Does Jimmy Carter Have No Shame?

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Joe Kawfi
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Does Jimmy Carter Have No Shame?

Carter was later asked by the South Korean media whether he believes there are human rights problems in North Korea. Carter’s response? He has “concerns” but North Korea’s policies “cannot be changed by outsiders.” Then he went on to declare that the most important human right is “to have food to eat and for South Korea and Americans, and others to deliberately withhold food aid for North Korean people…is indeed a human rights violation.”.

Got that? We’re the problem. Not the North Korean dictatorship.

JeffC
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You are so gullible Joe. Thanks for the laugh.

Thanks for linking to Frank Gaffney's site. I had forgotten about him.

Besides being a Birther and accusing Obama of being a Muslim, Gaffney accused Saddam Hussein of being involved in the bombing of the World Trade Center and the Oklahoma City bombing.

Gaffney accused Obama of pursuing "US submission to Islam". His evidence was the redesigned logo of the Missile Defense Agency that supposedly has a crescent in it like Obama's campaign logo:

"Team Obama’s anti-anti-missile initiatives are not simply acts of unilateral disarmament of the sort to be expected from an Alinsky acolyte. They seem to fit an increasingly obvious and worrying pattern of official U.S. submission to Islam and the theo-political-legal program the latter’s authorities call Shariah.

"What could be code-breaking evidence of the latter explanation is to be found in the newly-disclosed redesign of the Missile Defense Agency logo... the new MDA shield appears ominously to reflect a morphing of the Islamic crescent and star with the Obama campaign logo."

What is so hysterically funny is that the logo was redesigned during the Bush administration. This is real. I couldn't make this stuff up.

You can read this idiot's stuff here:

New Obama Missile Defense Logo Includes a Cresent

Up until then, I thought that Gaffney was just another paranoid freak with the IQ of a rutabaga. But then, after this year's CPAC convention, I have to admit that Gaffney changed my mind.

In early 2011, Gaffney charged that the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) had "come under the influence of the Muslim Brotherhood, which is working to bring America under Saudi-style Shariah law." Gaffney told the conservative website WorldNetDaily that "Islamism has infiltrated the American Conservative Union, the host of CPAC, in the person of Washington attorney and political activist Suhail Khan and a group called Muslims for America. Gaffney also accuses another ACU board member, leading conservative political organizer Grover Norquist, of helping the Muslim Brotherhood spread its influence in the nation's capital."

The CPAC War: Getting Weirder

Gaffney turns not out to be a raving lunatic after all but a purveyor of truth! CPAC is run by the Muslim Brotherhood under the direction of Grover Norquist with the aim of bringing America under Shariah law!

Joe Kwalfi and Frank Gaffney! You're in good company Joe.

Is the moon full tonight? LOLROTFLMAO.

maximus
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Did he say it jeff?

No where in your lunatic rant do you address what that lunatic Jimmy Carter was reported to have said: "But one of the most important human rights is to have food to eat. For the South Koreans and the Americans and others to deliberately withhold food aid to the North Korean people because of political or military issues not related is really a human rights violation." From the WSJ.

We need to get that idiot Carter off the streets. Perhaps we could employ the help of a close relative... I'll donate a hammer and some nails so that he can feel as if he's actually doing something.

kevink
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Jeff. Be very clear about Maximus' and jokeafwi's intent.

Look through their petty name calling and bluster. Is anyone really focused on your dad this week? Hell no. This is the second week in a row where these *conservative flame throwers have been made to look like ameteurs. They are very hard to be taken seriously. The Ryan budget is a non starter. The Birthers have been blown to bits. Their attacks on Democratic foreign policy ("Do we need a law professor in the White House?) have been PERMANENTLY silenced. PERMANENTLY. The Fox sponsored debate is all the example you need. "I commend the President for the capture of Osama bin Laden, but he is wrong on Libya." Yeah, TPaul. That will sell.

Jeff, these guys are hurting. Their team just got its butt and Bin Laden and a birth certificate handed to it.

Let them lash out , Jeff. Let them go home and kick their dogs, beat their wives, and smack their kids. That is how angry people react to very, very bad news. Egos bruised and confidence shaken, you are sure to read many, many more bizarre things important only to a very small segment of folks even on this right leaning venue. It is what it is, Jeff. Pop some popcorn, sit back, and enjoy the show.

Cheers

maximus
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What "team" are you talking about, Hack

The dim-witted former WPOTUS was in the news again, that’s the reason for the new comments, Hack. I didn’t realize we had to stick to a certain set of topics.

I hope you understand that the birthers being “blown to bits” is not a good thing for obumbles. He’s going to need all the distractions he can get next year. I think Jeff knows that, that’s why he refuses to let go of the issue.

Overturning this latest socialist usurpation of the constitution is far from over. Not sure where you get that idea. The Obumbling fool’s best chance against any of the more qualified republican candidates (which is all of them), is to realize what happened last weekend – he ignored his promises to the left and good things happened. Now if he does the same thing with healthcare, energy, taxes, union support, spending, etc. more good things will happen and he might have a shot at reelection. But let's be real - that ain't gonna happen.

kevink
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Maximus: My guess is you have no open windows and no clue of

what is happening in the world. Where to begin.

I have never said a particular topic is off limits, but if I, in the week of Osama bin Laden's death, bring up a comment by an ex president about North Korea (hurumpf!), it's going to be a bit transparent. Change the subject! Change the subject!

What team, Maximus? The team of frustrated name calling Jimmy Carter (The military Veteran) haters. Maximus? That would be YOU and Jokeawfi and a very select but vocal cast of fellow characters.

You said Jeff would not let "the issue" go. There was NEVER an issue in main stream America. That is what makes this so funny. The issue lived within your brave avatar and your echo chamber of Obama haters. And the gig is up. Ya'll look as idiotic today as you did last week and the week before. The lead birther Trump had to pivot to an affirmative action attack because of it. Hillarious stuff, Maximus.

Now. Your valued opinion is that our President, Barack Obama, is going to need "distractions" to get past the "more qualified republicans" like Michelle Bachmann, Tim Paulenty, Newt kicked out of Congress Gingrich, Donald Birther Trump, and Mike "couldn't make it out of the primaries in '08" Huckabee. Maximus, this is why I just can't take you seriously. In MY opinion, you are a very grumpy conservative that does not like the fact that a Democratic President is getting good press. He oversaw the capture and killing of a man your guy did not. He has a favorable opinion all over the world. He has overseen GM, Ford, and Chrysler's return to profitability when YOUR guys wanted GM and Chrysler dismantled. As a side note, that didn't actually jive with the GOP "jobs jobs jobs" lie. Why do I say lie? Because it has played out as Unions, Planned Parenthood, and Medicare."

Anyhow, you are in a fantasy land that I have NO PROBLEM WITH YOU being in. Any republican can beat President Barack Obama. Just you watch. We'll show obumbles the socialist America-hating communist marxist Kenyan.

Yes, Maximus. Tencredo tried that line of argument. Didn't work for him. Didn't work for Palin. But who knows, Maximus. You have made some bullet proof arguments that I am sure make since to folks who think a couple from Kenya could get a birth announcement in a Hawaiin paper 50 years ago. You've got an audience, bruh.

As for The President of The United States, Barack Obama, ignoring promises and catching OBL, when did he promise not to do that? Could you somehow be falsely conflating Iraq with OBL? Maybe you are talking about GITMO where we no longer torture. Problem there is, you can't tell me what roll GITMO played in this beyond your opinion. Yes?

Grumble on my unhappy friend. Meanwhile the Osama bin Laden is dead celebration will continue despite the grumpy and depressed and upstaged *conservativey *christiany *republicany brotherhood.

I love this stuff. Man! I love this stuff :-)

Locke
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The birth certificate is fake Kevink

You are misunderestimating the power of conspiracy theories.

The first birth certificate was a fake and the long form certificate said the same thing. Ergo, it must be a fake too. There can be no other possibility.

You are blind to how nefarious and devious Obama is. Sure the birthers look like idiots. That is exactly the way Obama and Trump planned it. Did you know that Michael Cohen, Trump's chief political adviser is a registered Democrat who voted for Obama in 2008? Did you know that most of Trump's political donations were to Democrats? Did you know that Trump once did a business deal with (gasp) George Soros? Did you know that some of Trump's biggest mortgages may be held by Obama's financial backers?

All of this is absolute and irrefutable proof that Trump is Obama's stooge, probably willingly but maybe blackmailed into his "exposing" the birth certificate charade. It was a brilliant plan that worked to perfection. Trump, the Birther's savior, appears on the scene and sends his investigators to Hawaii to uncover the Truth. The Birther's cheer! They rally! They move close to rapture! The Donald's poll numbers leap to the sky along with their praises for him! Then Obama releases his long form. It is obviously fake too but there is Trump declaring himself satisfied. What a bummer that is. How could this possibly be? So the Birther's reassess. Their best minds (?) get together and mull the situation. Could it possibly be that Obama really is an American citizen? Of course not. The real Birther's cannot be fooled. The conclusion is obvious: Trump is in on the conspiracy! The veil is lifted.

Unfortunately for you and your fervent denials that the issue has been laid to rest, Judi McLeod has all this figured out. In case you don't know, Judi McLeod is an award-winning journalist with 30 years experience in the print media. She claims, and I have no reason to doubt her, that her work has appeared on Rush Limbaugh, Newsmax.com, Drudge Report, Foxnews.com, and Glenn Beck.

Is this The Donald’s business deal of a lifetime?

Keep on pretending that this is not a vital issue. The Truth is out there.

Davids mom
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Locke

Are you serious? Forget the certificate. Any thinking person knows that wherever Obama's mother was on his birthdate - that is where he was born. The rest of the world is laughing at this ! Prove Obama's mom was in Kenya - or for Pete's sake - put a lid on it!

Locke
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No Davids mom

I'm not serious but Judi McLeod is. I think the whole thing is hysterically funny. When your political opponents are self destructing, stand back and let it happen.

Having said that, I'm standing by the conspiracy theory that Trump is in on it. It's just too sweet not to go with.

So Trump moves on to the college transcripts. I support him! Now consider this, Trump and the Birthers claim that Obama lacked the grades. As you know, President Obama was editor of the Harvard Law Review. In BirtherWorld, Harvard is well known to award this position to its lowest achievers, right? So what are you going to say when, in a few months, the Donald heroically forces President Obama to release those records. What if those records show that Obama went to real world Harvard where the editor of the Law Review is among the top achievers instead of BirtherWorld Harvard?

The Birthers will hail Trumps achievement! Hurray for The Donald! He made us look like complete idiots again!

My conspiracy theory explains everything.

Davids mom
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Locke

LOL!! I" m waiting for Trump to endorse Obama!

JeffC
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Please Davids mom, No!

They can keep him. In what Public Policy Polling described as "one of the quickest rises and falls in the history of presidential politics," Donald Trump has plummeted from a field-leading 26 percent in the polls to a mere 8 percent. He's now tied with Ron Paul for fifth.

Mitt Romney is going to Iowa for the first time. He's in. All the rest is distraction. Mitt's the nominee.

Ninja Guy
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Scalers Replace Birthers!

I am part of a new pressure group formed to DEMAND that the Donald step on the scales! We have not had an obese person in the Oval Office since William H. Taft (well Clinton did get kind of doughy at one point, and that is when he went after Monica!), and that is a good thing! Fat people put food before all else! Obama is skinny, maybe overly so. He ain't thinking about food let me tell you! He's got the peoples' business on his mind, not Big Macs!

I and my scaler buddies want Trump on the scales in full view of the public, including Marla and that guy that used to sniff her shoes! He is hiding his true weight with man corsets and girdles! CBS has the tape, but was forced to spike it by Ivanka, who refused to do another Maxim spread unless they did!

When the truth comes out, the scales will show Trump at 300+ pounds, most of it shrimp scampi residue in his large intestine! Perhaps parts of Jimmy Hoffa too!

Scalers on the move! The truth will be revealed!

Go Hawks! Tied at 2 all! Josh Smith finally acting like a basketball player! Kobe gone! Legacy ruined. Gasol's fault!

Ninja Guy
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Locke Schlock

Locke, it matters not where President Barry was born. Stanley was certainly born in the US, which means that President Barry was a 'natural born' citizen the second he entered this world, whether in Hawaii or Timbuktu! Please correct your ignorance before it's too late! The end is near!

Amen I say to you: Go Braves! Take 2 out of 3 from the Phillies tonight! Jurgens on the mound! He is a foreigner!

kevink
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Locke. Thank God there are idiots like you and I to artificially

keep the President's numbers up. As maximus said, any of the repubs (Gasp! Even Trump) are more qualified for the office of President than the current Bin Laden hunting dude. I'm glad you are around so I don't have to be the only crazy-thinking non-neocon around here... well, besides Bacon... oh and Jeff. Oh yes, and Davidsmom. And Mainstream. And I can't forget Carbon. Did I forgot anyone?

carbonunit52
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Crazy-thinking non-neocons

Kevink, I am glad I got a mention with such a group.

I have wanted to post in this thread for awhile, of course to say something in defense of Jimmy Carter and Barack Obama, for no other reason than they so richly deserve it. The historical perspective will be very kind to both of them. The party of "No" is exactly that now, no accomplishments, no direction, no "mojo" at all.

Locke
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Well NNC Kevin

It seems now that it was never an issue at all. It turns out that nobody ever saw or knew a Birther in any way shape or form except for those dastardly libs that kept bringing it up.

Except I saw a FOX News poll which showed that 47 percent of Republicans thought the President Obama was not born in the United States.

Poll: Obama's Birth Certificate Puts Issue to Rest

This brings up two interesting points. First, where did all those Republicans in the FOX poll get their information from? I'm trying to think of any news source or network that demographic sampled by the FOX poll watches that could have influenced and seemingly misdirected them so that they showed up so prominently in the FOX poll. So far I cannot think of where those FOX poll Republicans could have possibly gotten such misinformation as shown in the FOX poll.

Secondly, and even more revealing, those 47% of Republicans believed that Obama was not born in the United States in spite of the fact that Obama released his birth certificate in June of 2008. It was a perfectly valid legal document, certified by the State of Hawaii and accepted by the United States government when he applied for his passport and as proof of citizenship when he ran for President. The Republican Governor vouched for its authenticity. Two newspapers published his birth at the time. And yet, in spite of the overwhelming evidence and proof after proof, 47% of Republicans did not believe it, displaying an immunity to facts, a susceptibility to the most outlandish and ridiculous propaganda, and a complete inability to differentiate between the two.

It is disquieting.

Observerofu
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I do find it interesting

that Democrats were not included as a result in this poll. Just "ALL"-"Rep" or "Teaparty" but not Independents nor Democrats as a separate group.

kevink
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And, Locke, it is concrete proof that FOX viewers are very well

informed..... in their not so humble and quite overstated opinions. This is The political world we live in.

roundabout
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Difference in "believing" and facts!

Those 47% of republicans, TEAS, and other radicals, who said President Obama was not a US citizen simply used the doubt sewn by them to perpetuate hate for the President.
They really hated he had a black Father and couldn't get over it.

In my judgement about one-half of them will think and hope that until he is no longer President!

There are those one-half of them who still think a big snake tricked Eve!
God made no such snake! Eve was a hotty! Also, she liked apples. This tale was made up by Abraham or Moses to explain to kids about the birds and bees. It could have been one of the trade surgeons of the day who couldn't blame it all on leaches or miracles.

I suspect Moses since he turned his walking stick into a snake---maybe the same snake! Weren't those ancient snakes crawling arond on their belly being punishd that way forever for dis-obeying GOD?

Main Stream
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Hi Hack...good to see you on here!

Hope all is well with you and your family! I'm mostly a lurker on the blogs these days, still laughing at the right-winger's, the "after-birther's", tongue-speakers, TEA-ocons, and the other circus performers who make up the Fayette County Republican party. The entertainment never ends on here!

I agree, it's great to see our "team" (Bacon, DM, Jeff, Carbon) continuing the good fight for us on the blogosphere!. Hey, if you ever want to hang out with some other liberals in F-County, email me and I'll send you a link to our website. (that includes any other libs who might be interested). Some of them even play golf!

Davids mom
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Republicans in New York

struggling to hold on to a seat! Sending in the big guns - along with Rove stratigists. This will be interesting to watch!

AtHomeGym
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MainScream & The Team

Carbo, you see this? And all the while I thought you were straddling the white line and now I am told you were in the left lane all the time--is this how you want to be perceived? My,my, we could just be headed for a ban on Hawaiian shirts at Coffee Calls! I mean, I always suspected you did sniff a little Pine Bark occasionally, but this charge is shocking!

carbonunit52
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AtHomeGym,

Actually, I consider myself to be a staunch conservative, in that I think that conservation is very very important :). Politically, it is true that I am quite left of center, mostly because the center moved so far to the right and I pretty much stayed put. Down deep, I am just a country boy that likes pickup trucks, admires hard work, protects kind hearts, hates waste, and looks good in Hawaiian shirts.

AtHomeGym
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Carbo & 'Down Deep"

Well, I can sympathize with all that. What you are really saying is that Mainscream is a tad off base in listing you as a "team member" for whatever Mainsceam defines as a "liberal team." I'm sure you and I can find common ground on many things. Oh, got a truck (98CMC), worked faithfully for 42 yrs before retiring, born & raised in rural NC--no way we can be too far apart! Now we might have to talk about the shirts!

PTC Observer
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Main Stream

Why would you leave Lion and Ninja off this list?

What exactly is the "good fight"?

Could you outline this a bit for the rest of us? I for one would like to understand the principles of your "good fight". Start with the first principle first please.

Thanks in advance.

maximus
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Quite the tirade, Hack!

Where to begin.?

I guess I must have missed a lengthy “birther” discussion around here. Profound waste of time. I really don’t know anyone personally who has questioned obamau’s natural born status. I know they’re out there, but I hear a lot more from the libs who want to make it a topic than from the “birthers” themselves.

“…overseen GM, Ford, and Chrysler's return to profitability”. Are you delusional, Hack? First off, Ford didn’t go bankrupt and they have done just fine without my forced contribution, and GM is nothing but a taxpayer money pit. The bondholder’s rights were stripped by that moron obumbles in true Hugo Chavez style. Is that what you want for business in the U.S.?

GM should have gone through the bankruptcy process just like Delta did. If they couldn’t convince investors that the whole was worth more than the pieces, then the pieces would have been sold off. That’s the way it’s supposed to work. Put the capital to better use. Instead, your Dear Leader forces all of us to “invest” our money so that those losers in the UAW don’t have to take a bigger pay cut or lose their undeserved pensions.

It’s not just my opinion that GITMO and enhanced interrogation played a huge role in tracking down ubl, even Leon Panetta acknowledge the fact. An unpleasant fact for the libs, a pleasant outcome for America.

Now, as far as the former WPOTUS goes, you may have a point. What’s the use of piling on some frustrated, senile has-been?

Happy Mother’s Day to the Mrs.

kevink
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Maximus, You do have a point.

"What’s the use of piling on some frustrated, senile has-been?"

You're right, mate. I'll leave you alone now :-D. Just kidding. Hope all the mothers in your life were pampered today.

Cheers

Joe Kawfi
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Permanently?

Aaahahahahaha. Your really are a joke now, aren't you Kevin? Now that peace prize winner has gone into a country unilaterally without the blessing of the UN and blown the head off of an unarmed man, according to you we have been silenced? Talk about amateurs, Kevin. As I said before, one action does not make him a leader. What about all of the enhanced interrogation techniques that this lame "president" refuses to acknowledge as the linchpin of the intelligence needed to get bin Laden?
Obama is too small of a man too give credit to the efforts of the previous administration. No, he just shuts down the black sites and refuses to continue the very techniques that were REQUIRED to gather this information.

No, I don't kick the dog, beat the wife, or smack the kids. That's the kind of stuff people like you do when they get angry.

I just sit back and laugh at your lame attempts to paint Obama as anything but a miserable failure. He will not be re-elected, you can count on that.

Davids mom
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Class/Dignity

The Republicans and Democrats who operate with dignity and class, including Bush and Obama, have handled this situation (the death of Osama) well. It's the comments made by the 'kawfi's' of the country who are making the world realize that there are classless Americans. Sadly, Kawfi doesn't realize his continued denigration of others only degrades him/her.

Robert W. Morgan
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Right about class, Moms, 'cept for the censored part of 60 min.

Steve Kroft asked Obamaistan if he felt that the Bush policies on terrorist interrogations helped to find the thankfully now dead Osama Bin Ladin. You should have seen the look on his face. You should have seen his answer. Priceless. Didn't see it? Oh yea, me neither because the Administration of Barack Hussein Obama forced CBS to edit it out. What in the world is going on? Prezbo edits 60 Minutes? Huh?

The All-about-me dictator in chief is my President for now. I applaud the take down of Bin Ladin by the Seals and the support group. I applaud President Barack Hussein Obama for making the gutsy call to do what had to be done. I want to move on beyond this and focus on the economy. Got any professionals there, Prezbo?

Chris P. Bacon
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I must say

I must say it gives me a great deal of amusement to watch RINO W. Morgan flailing about, searching in vain for something...ANYTHING....to detract from giving credit to the Obama administration for the successful raid on Bin Laden.

But..but..."16 hour delay!" "Victory lap!" "Censorship!"

Keep flinging feces, monkey morgan.

roundabout
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Censoring 60 minutes?

I doubt it.

You are just a little late in joining your other Presidential haters and wanting to go to the economy in order to change the subject about birthing and Bin Laden!

Don't be too concerned, the President will pretty much have the economy in hand in a couple of years more. It was so bad it couldn't improve much quickly. Wonder who was in charge when it got that way? The 2012 election will indicate who was in charge!

What is left of the republican party will be gone by the time Newt, Sarah, The TEAS, Huckleberry (The Priest), Paul, Paul's son, and bawl baby verbalize stuff soon! (What is that woman from Delaware named--I can't remember?) (There is another female congresswoman......doesn't matter.)

Davids mom
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An interesting point of view
Robert W. Morgan
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It may be interesting Moms, but it is not new

Goldie has an interesting twist on the birther thing - that it is - News Flash, News Flash - All about race!

Of course for some, everything is about race.

The birther's are nuts, Trump is using the issue as a side show and normal people are completely color blind to both of Obama's races and focus only on actions. If you want to take a sheet with 2 columns, 1 headed with Achievements as President; the other headed with Failures as President, you can start making your lists and see how each column fills up.

This way you won't waste time with things like "He graduated from college" or "Ran a good campaign" or "Can play basketball" or "Voted mostly present as a State Senator" or "Supported partial birth abortion" or "Sponsored nothing as a US Senator" Get the picture - just what he did or didn't do as President.

Davids mom
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Rm

How about sharing that 'censored' segment you referred to?

Achievements:

1. Beat Republicans (McCain)

2. Ordered and executed the bringing Osama to justice for killing thousands on American soil,

3. Turned a depression around -

4. Regained international respect for the US

5. Healthcare Reform!!!

6. Is handling the heckling and disrespect of some citizens with dignity.

Is he perfect? Of course not. But he's been a pretty good captain in steering us through some rough waters.

Does everyone agree with me? Of course not here in the heart of conservative America. But as I listen to conservative concerns I'm made aware that many of our concerns are the same - we just have very different opinions on how to go about finding solutions to problems. To deny that some see 'race' in some of the discussion about Obama is just not dealing in the reality of the attitude of some citizens in this country. We all base our reality /perspective on our own experience and background. Your apparent denial on the painful residual of Jim Crow is related to your perspective and background.

My prediction : Obama will serve a second term; Trump will endorse Obama; roundabout will be appointed Secretary of Education; Kawfi will be deported since he has no birth certificate; PTCO will be mayor of PTC ; and Ooou will be committed for observation. Lakers were sent home-36 points short. Sad, sad, sad.

mudcat
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2 out of 6 ain't bad, DM. that batting avg. gets ya $500k in MLB

The scoring
#1 doesn't count - he wasn't President when he did that
#2 is true - so far you are 1 for 2
#3,4,5 - don't belong in the plus column
#6 - Ok , we'll give that one to you, but why the heckling? Because he is right?

And whaaaaaat about Bush????? Couldn't resist. He kept the country safe for 7 years, went to church, handled the disrespect with dignity, executed Sadaam Heussein and his 2 sons and did not whine about how bad his previous President was. Didn't support killing of innocent babies. Didn't protect the southern border (that's a minus in case you need reminding).

Your predictions are just plain stupid, crossing dresser but mine are that Obama goes down with less than 40% of the vote to Pawlenty or Cain. Clinton, Gates, Panetta all leave and one of them sets up for a 2016 run for President, Sure roundabout can be mayor of PTC as he makes as much sense as the current mayor - let's hear from his wifey.

roundabout
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MUD

No Secretary of Education or Mayor for me.

Too limiting! Too easy.

Bush may have kept Washington. D.C. safe for seven years (just as he did Texas before-part time), but there are about 4-5,000 dead and 40,000 wounded American military families who don't feel safe. Don't know how many allied, and about 200,000 Arabs dead and innumerable wounded, that would disagree with the "safe" stuff!

HOW SOON WE FORGET THEM!

Davids mom
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Rm

Would you share that censored part with us? We know that with the intelligence team that Obama and Bush had at their disposal, everything was done to get this man. Condoleeza Rice stated that she was under the impression that Osama was in the 'caves'. The 60 Minute interview was focused on what this team had organized and the outstanding performance of our 'special forces'. Again, a class act all the way around.

Robert W. Morgan
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Well see Moms, censored means it was not shown,

so since it wasn't shown, it is not out there to see. Hope that wasn't too complicated.

And don't expect a disgruntled staffer to sneak it out either. CBS is totally in the tank for Prezbo. This is not like a Bill O'Riley staffer objecting to showers with the boss, this is serious stuff and CBS really thinks we need Obama for 4 more years. After all, the US of A self-destructing? What a story. What a story for TV.

Chris P. Bacon
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Cal Beverly, censor-in-chief!
Robert W. Moran wrote:

"censored" means it was not shown, so since it wasn't shown, it is not out there to see. Hope that wasn't too complicated.

But....but....if "censor" is a synonym for "edit", then that means that Cal Beverly is the CENSOR-IN-CHIEF! who knew?

well, THAT explains a lot....thanks for clearing that up, Mr. Moran!

kevink
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Jokeawfi. You are not an honest person.

"What about all of the enhanced interrogation techniques that this lame "president" refuses to acknowledge as the linchpin of the intelligence needed to get bin Laden?"

There has been not one single official statement from persons involved in the operation which killed Bin Laden that called torture a "linchpin" of intelligence. You lie...again Jokeawfi.

"Obama is too small of a man too give credit to the efforts of the previous administration."

He invited George W. Bush to share in the ground zero wreath laying Jokeawfi. You are a very small man who lies as if we are as obtuse as you are.

" Now that peace prize winner has gone into a country unilaterally without the blessing of the UN and blown the head off of an unarmed man...."

Poor poor Bin Laden, Joe. You feel for his pain don't you? I'm starting to think you ARE a sick dude, and not just playing the part. I need a shower after replying to this. eeewwwwww.

Davids mom
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Joe ?
Quote:

" Now that peace prize winner has gone into a country unilaterally without the blessing of the UN and blown the head off of an unarmed man...."

The president said it best: Anyone who feels that the man who orchestrated the murder of thousands on American soil and rejoiced in their death should be considered an unarmed innocent, needs their head examined. This man was a war criminal who received justice. Obama had the approval of the American people and the living presidents who rejoiced with him when they were informed that this murderer had been dealt with.

carbonunit52
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*

*

Mike King
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Great Spin Jeff....

... Now, would you address Joe's question? Is it really not the fault or result of the North Korean dictatorship that its citizens are hungry?

JeffC
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Absolutely Mike

The government has devastated the economy. The revaluation of the currency and the closing of the semi-free food markets were both catastrophic by themselves. Taken together along with the sever drought, the farmers have been impoverished even more. Some have lost up to 75% of their net worth which was pitiful to start with.

In the famine during the '90s, almost 2 million peopled starved to death out of a population of 24 million. Much of that was the fault of government policies also that resulted in sanctions. Conditions now are much the same. This year they will be short 500,000 tons of grain. Calorie intake is falling to 450 calories per day in some areas. Today I read an article describing how some people are eating rats and grass.

Should another 2 million people starve to death because of the failure of the government? They're going to. If a North Korean peasant showed up starving at the door of virtually any blogger here they'd feed them no matter how they opine now to just let them starve over there. The difference is that we actually see them starving over there.

PC has no government mandate to negotiate. He has no sanction by any government. Everybody knows that. If they can't stand the criticism they are free to disregard. But what's going to happen now? President Lee today is reconsidering his no-food policy to NK. Probably, SK is going to end up shipping 170,000 tons of grain. Probably, the 120,000 tons held by private US charities will be allowed to be shipped; the US is inclined that way anyway.

Does he get all the credit? No. Some piece of the credit? Probably. Maybe. Who cares? Some governments have to respond and justify their actions? So what, who cares? Criticism? Who cares? Negative editorials in newspapers ignoring the fact that 2 million people are going to starve. Who cares? It won't be the first time. It won't be the thousandth time.

I am a liberal blogging here in a nest of right-wing Republicans. Believe me, I know that. Most of you I consider wrong but you can uphold your end of the argument which I like and admire. Most of you consider me wrong but I hope you consider me able to uphold my end of the argument with reasoned facts. A few, like the author of this blog, frankly, seem to have very limited grasp of reality and, really, nothing to contribute except abusive comments. I've been insulted before. I consider the source. If Joe wants to make career of posting abusive junk, what do I care? I read lots of stuff in lots of places. Some is worthy of consideration, some isn't. Your's and the majority of bloggers here are, Joe's isn't. He has never shown the slightest capacity of contributing anything relevant.

Who cares?

You'd feel the same way.

Mike King
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Jeff

Likely the most indepth response in some time here. Some might even say a voice of reason, but from me, thanks for taking the time.

JeffC
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Mike K

Here is some of the implausible back-story:

China ready for Korea reunification

Take it for what it's worth but it's interesting.

BHH
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Your statement almost describes the U. S. under Democrats

"The government has devastated the economy. The revaluation of the currency and the closing of the semi-free food markets were both catastrophic by themselves. Taken together along with the sever drought, the farmers have been impoverished even more. Some have lost up to 75% of their net worth which was pitiful to start with."

Is this somehow prophetic?

I'm not sure what is meant by "right-wing" but I am currently in favor of increasing Republican policies in our country.

Democrats seem to continually put restrictions on free markets as in socialism.

Republicans seem to try to open and unrestrict them like free commerce.

Why does anyone in a free country want to force socialism upon themselves?

Our government is like a pendulum and that's the only way it can work. Anything too extreme in either direction upsets a delicate balance and sends it swinging in the other direction.

It could work somewhere in the middle but that point is probably unachievable. So it must keep swinging.

kevink
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BHH: Don't like government as run by democrats?

Best get busy finding a candidate for 2012. Who might that be, BHH? Like Spear Road guy says, Get on your feet. Vote Republican. You'll have that Fair Tax in no time and lose the ability to write off mortgage interest.

BHH
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That increased sales tax is not what I'm after.

I'm after less government meddling and less tax.

Truth be known, I pay very little federal tax now.

The state and local taxes are the bastards to pay.

I want less taxing and regulation of small businesses owned by the individuals in our communities who are trying to make a living and employ other locals.

The "fair tax" looks good on the surface but it is just another tax increase and guarantees nothing.

Everyone who has accumulated anything after taxes under the current system will be taxed again on that asset whenever it is reinvested in any other retail purchase.

All forms of government in this country are raking in more money than they know what do with.

The school systems being the biggest culprits. Anything "for the children" will get you elected and pass a tax increase.

The best thing that could happen to this country would be the privatization of education and elimination of those damned government sponsored buses and the fuel they burn.

Government meddling in the day to day lives of most people would immediately cease.

I agree that education is a priority and that everyone should seek the best education for their children. But they should have to actively seek it and it is not a God given right and responsibility of their fellow citizens to foot the bill for this education.

JeffC
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FairTax Kevin?

With the FairTax, there would be nothing to write off mortgage interest against. No income tax thus deductions are moot.

Instead, The FairTax has the Treasury determine the prime rate each month. Any interest you pay over that rate is a financial service charge and is subject to the 26% FairTax. This applies to all interest debt including credit cards. Any interest payments over the prime rate will cost 26% more. This is not an existing tax being modified by the FairTax. This is new tax.

Don't read the book, until after you've read the legislation.

Cheers!

roundabout
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The fuzzed up complicated "fair tax".........

........reminds me of what I heard Speaker Boehner say this morning from a moneyed meeting in NYC where he spoke.

He said something like this: The President will find any tax increase off the table, and also if the debt limit is increased he will have to have more cuts in the budget than what the debt increase is!

Now any one who knows anything about accounting can tell you, Boehner's proposal wouldn't get by a CPA and he knows it!

The administration has already said that the new health plan will save enough over current costs to balance the budget along with allowing the old temporary tax cuts of Bush's to expire for corporations and rich people.

Boehner and the House say that the new health plan will cost more than it currently costs, and of course any increase in taxes on corporations is off the table.

So folks, pick a side and we will shut down the government this summer and just wait for Newt to be nominated, and instead of him shutting it down again, he can start it back up this time!

Is it possible we could shut down PTCs government, not pay any city employees, not pay the county any school taxes, and only mow the grass to suit some on here who want that above everything! Oh, and repave the cart paths using the Mayor, Council, and volunteers.

I would hope the sheriff would pick up touring of PTC!

Observerofu
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Agreed Jeff get the facts

http://www.fairtax.org/PDF/PromotingHomeOwnership.pdf

The fact is that even though the FairTax makes the MID irrelevant, housing is not only
more affordable but homebuyers will have more money with which to purchase their home.
There are several reasons for this:
• Most home sales are for used homes, and unlike today, taxpayers can use pretax earnings
to buy used homes.
• Unlike the current tax regime, the FairTax does not tax the earnings used to pay mortgage
interest. Even if the MID offset all income taxes, interest would still be paid with what
one has left over after payroll taxes.
• Mortgage debt will be paid at a lower interest rate since the FairTax lowers the interest
rate of such debt.
• While a new home is taxed, the FairTax imposes a lower marginal rate of tax on the
earnings used to buy the home.
• Unlike the current tax regime, the FairTax fully untaxes capital gains from the sales of
used or new property.
• The FairTax removes all embedded tax costs of current construction by untaxing the
businesses involved in home construction and producing building supplies.
• The FairTax enables homeowners to save for a home faster by not taxing savings, unlike
today.
• The FairTax improves the economy and increases national income by removing the drag
the current system imposes on economic growth.

JeffC
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Read the legislation OOU

We can debate the FairTax later in another forum perhaps. I'm hoping Herman Cain makes it an issue.

Your missive is seemingly full of assumptions and misinformation. For instance: "Mortgage debt will be paid at a lower interest rate since the FairTax lowers the interest rate of such debt."

No where does the FairTax legislation regulate interest rates in any way shape or form. In any event, this jumps into the FairTax way beyond the basics. I know we've discussed it before but I have forgotten your level of understanding of the tax.

So, let me ask you this:

If you make $1000 a week and take home $800, what is your paycheck going to be after the FairTax is implemented?

Joe Kawfi
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Yuk it up, Jeff

You never did refute the premise of the article, which is that Jimmy Carter is America's embarassment. He's the crazy uncle in the attic that should be put in a home for elderly people suffering from dimentia. All you did was try to denigrate a person that didn't even write the article.

Frank Gaffney didn't write the article, Peter Schweizer did. You did give it the good ol' typical liberl Alinsky try though. You didn't refute the what the article stated, you merely tried to personalize it by putting down the individual that reported what Jimmy Carter stated.

Good grief, if you don't like reading my posts, no one is forcing you to read them. You need help, son.

JeffC
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Who said I didn't like your stuff Joe?

I'm shocked, shocked, that you think I was trying to denigrate Frank Gaffney. How could you possibly think that when everything I posted came directly from his writings?

It seems that it should be fair for me to comment on the the demonstrated historical accuracy and clarity of thought of your influential thinkers.

kevink
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Joe.............

never mind.

Joe Kawfi
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KevinK

No one cares what you have to say anyway, JAGGOFF!

kevink
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No one cares what I have to say jokeawfi.

That's why you even reply to my non comments. Angry man. Angry, hurt, frustrated man.

BHH
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You get his point anyway.

Jimmy may not have said it just right but his point is well taken.

roundabout
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NO FOOD for N. Korea

Maximus and Kawfi---People on here have been saying how terrible Scots/Irish descendents are, and if that is so then you two must be two of them!

The USA entire foreign aid program, including war tools and food is less than 1% of our budget.

All we give them generally is stuff we don't want as far as food and other stuff is concerned. We pay our corporate farmers to grow more grain than we need, mor powdered milk than we need, more cheese than we need, etc., and what would you have us do with that?

You say not to welfare queens; not to N. Korea; not to schools; etc., so what do you wish? That the poor and ignorant and kids of N. Korea starve?
I suppose so!

You two aren't worth explaining anything to!

Chris P. Bacon
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Food and suffering

Two years ago, the North Korea government literally bit the hand that was feeding it when their paranoid leaders ordered food relief workers out of their country on very short notice (they left behind 20,000 tons of food, though).

Now North Korea has less than a month's worth of food left, and they are wanting to "restart talks" without any preconditions (or so they say), just bring back food, pretty please.

The US government believes that food sent to North Korea would be diverted to the huge North Korean military. There is a bit of history to back up that claim.

Nevertheless, people are going hungry in North Korea. Many Republicans believe that withholding food and medicine to "undeserving" people so that they sicken and die is prudent foreign policy. Thankfully, they are in the minority.

Jimmy Carter is right to urge that feeding starving people ought to transcend politics. At the same time, controls are needed to make sure that this food goes where its supposed to go.

maximus
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More libtard spin from Baked.

The people of North Korea would be perfectly capable of feeding themselves if their communist/socialist/progressive/statist/whatever you want to call it, government would let them. But morons like you and Carter want to blame republicans/Americans for the starvation rather than those who actually cause it. At least you’re capable of admitting that “there is a bit of history” to show us where the food aid will end up - to keep the military and bureaucrats fed while they continue to impose progressivism on the people.

Just wondering, sniffy boy, do you and the rest of the progressive, socialist, libtards ever wonder why there is such a huge difference in the standard of living between North and South Korea?

BHH
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It's Biblically correct to feed your enemies.

Proverbs 25:21 NIV
New International Version
If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat; if he is thirsty, give him water to drink.

Romans 12:20 NIV
New International Version
On the contrary: "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."

Main Stream
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It may be in the bible...

"It's biblically correct to feed your enemies."

..but Joe and the other conservatives aren't really "followers of Christ"...they're CINO's (christians in name only).

Plus, Jesus was a liberal and would have been shunned and ridiculed by the CINO's if he walked the earth today.

Mike King
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Great Point Main....

... But what would you say to Him regarding your Pro Choice stance?

Main Stream
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Jesus was a pro-choice liberal...
Mike King wrote:

... But what would you say to Him regarding your Pro Choice stance?

Mike, I guess I would say I was pro-choice because Jesus's "dad" (god) did not mention abortion in the bible, "draws a clear demarcation between the killing of a person and the killing of a fetus", plus, "it treats the death of a fetus as a non-homicide and makes no attempt to punish women who have abortions."

http://civilliberty.about.com/od/abortion/f/bible_abortion.htm

BHH
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Any human death is a great loss .Even Bin Laden's,

except that he deserved it and had it coming.

The article at the sight you mention is very good. I am Christian and yet pro choice and anti abortion.

I do not agree with abortion in most cases but the choice has to rest with the potential mother and no one else. Only she and her unborn child will realize the consequences.

It ultimately does no direct harm to anyone else and society should impose no action against the potential mother except education, compassion and support for her decision.

How did we get on this subject anyway?

NUK_1
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BHH: Well said

I agree 100% with your thoughts here.

BHH
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Thank you NUK

I appreciate your consideration.

maximus
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My enemy is not hungry, BHH and main extreme.

The fat little turd has more than enough to fill his face every day. The people have been starving for decades, with or without the food that has been sent in to prop up his military.

BHH
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maximus, yes you have a good point, but

I will still stand by Jimmy Carter and his intentions in this instance.

roundabout
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BHH

Well, we just ignore such "Bible" stuff as that! Too liberal.

Mike King
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Chris P

We all agree that elimination of hunger should transcend politics, but the fact is that it doesn't.

"Many Republicans believe that withholding food and medicine to "undeserving" people so that they sicken and die is prudent foreign policy. Thankfully, they are in the minority." Could this be an opinion based on extensive time spent on the Korean Penninsula, or just another shot at those of us who might hold a differing view?

Chris P. Bacon
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King Mike

Alright, we both agree that hunger should transcend politics, but that it largely does not.

The question I would then ask: what to do about that? Should we wash our hands of a difficult task just because it is difficult?

With regard to your second question, an objective mind would notice that policies promulgated by today's Republican party tend to aid and comfort the well-to-do at the expense of society's poorest and sickest. That is not the approach advocated by Christ, but then, very few Republicans nowadays follow Christ.

PTC Observer
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Bacon - Why

is it that we seem to want to put our nose into other countries business all the time? Their starving masses are their business.

Leave them alone, all of them. Just trade with them, if they want to buy something from us then let them buy it, if we want to buy something from them then we buy it.

We should restrict trading only to things that we believe can be used in the future to attack us.

We should do the same thing with Cuba and Korea that we did with China.

Trade with them.

Chris P. Bacon
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Therein lies the rub, Petey C

Ah, "nothing but trade" doesn't fare well in the real world, I'm afraid.

The only thing North Korea has that appears to have any value as an export are nuclear devices and medium range missles of dubious quality.

Not much of a market for either of the above in the USA....do we want other nations trading food for nukes?

The world is a complicated place.

PTC Observer
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Bacon - You

are wrong about this, as you are in many things. Have you ever been to Korea? The South seems to be doing pretty well, there's nothing distinguishing the North and the South except the political system.

They have plenty to trade in natural resources and cheap labor, just like China. We should give them the opportunity to do it. You'll be surprised how capitalistic they can become.

As for the nukes, go re-read my post.

The world is a complicated place, you should go out and see some of it and get off your perch.

Mike King
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Chrispy

Realizing you prefer to demonize most of our right wing pals, I will take a shot at answering for Petey C.

North Korea has a substantial ability to barter with its nuclear technology that was derived from the USA in the nineties, and would you care to guess how many third world countries are willing to pay handsomely for that same technology? Our friend Jeff Carter could elaborate on those governments that have it on their 'wish list' and are able to afford Dear Leader's asking price, but he likely won't.

It really wasn't that complicated until his dad, Secretary Albright, and President Clinton assured a mutual destruction capability on the Korean Penninsula.

PTC Observer
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Mike King - Right wing?

Could you define "right wing" for me?

I don't think I am right wing if you mean also conservative, I would say I am more radical than right wing. I am certainly not conservative and dislike conservatives because they simply carry on the socialist agenda that has been set before them. They have no ideas for radically changing what clearly is not working in our government.

Actually, there are a number of social issues on which I agree with Bacon and Ninja, however their political views stink and are born out of either self interest or public education or both.

Our socialist friends seem to get most upset when someone advocates dismantling the government and reducing its power. Imagine that.

It is the basic concept of individual freedom and personal responsibility that seems to frigthen them the most. After all they would rather keep things just the way they are, they are both conservatives and have no ideas.

Do you believe we should trade with the North Koreans? Or do you think we need to "contain" them?

Mike King
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PTC-O

My definition of 'right wing' would be a mindset of Jeudo-Christian values that not only promotes individual responsibility but demands it. This is simply because I believe for anyone to be truly free they must take responsibility for their successes, failures, and most of all their obligations.

Kris Kristofferson had it right when he penned the line "freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose" for it is just that. Freedom comes with responsibility for his next line "nothing ain't worth nothing, but it's free" pretty much defines those who choose to exist under the umbrella of the government taking responsibility for their obligations.

No, we should not trade with the North Koreans, nor should we hinder faith based charitable efforts. Containment, as you put it has worked quite well over the past nearly sixty years.

roundabout
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MIKE: N. Korea

They have the bomb now and are about the only one who would use it!

They will have "nothing left to lose," soon.

Feed the hungry instead of starving them out. If you depend upon Jews and Christians giving them enough food--they surely will starve.

Then bomb their bomb factories! Prepare for a million of them into S. Korea the next week! Blowing bugles as they go!

Chris P. Bacon
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Double post

Double post.
Double post.

AtHomeGym
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PTC-O & NK Priorities

NK doesn't seem to have a problem paying for missile & nuclear technology from whoever to bolster their miitary capability. Their govt sets priorities as does ours. Their decisions to favor military capability over care & feeding of the populace are distasteful to societies who are more caring, but for us to once again insert ourselves in what we term "humanitarian" operations (like Libya) is nothing more than a mandate on our citizenship to surrender our hard-earned goods & services to those who should be held responsible for their stupid decisions.

NUK_1
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Food aid to North Korea

Since it's next door neighbor China(and Russia) is the biggest impediment to any change ever happening in North Korea because they don't want to see a unified Korea sitting on their border, let China feed them, not the US and the UN.

China and Russia can carry this burden since they consider North Korea to be their "ally" against the US and South Korea and are constantly in the the way of any progress being made in dragging North Korea into the civilized world instead of the total cesspool and danger to others it is right now.

I understand Carter's humanitarian concerns, but I don't buy into his view of the world whatsoever and he's still extremely naive as ever. When he says "outside forces can't change NK," he's showing a whole lot of pollyanna ignorance. China can force any change they want on North Korea anytime they feel like doing so, but their position is that they don't want refugees or have to take care of North Korea either. Why should we? Let Darwin take its course.

BHH
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I 'm still more concerned with our neighboring tornado victims.

I will agree that charity begins at home and that we are not currently at war with N. Korea.

So the "feed your enemy" reference I made may not yet apply.

I am still a fan of Carter and his unending personal efforts and ability to negotiate good things from bad situations around the world.

He is a true hero in many of these efforts and deserving of praise.

Mike King
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Bacon Chris

I'm glad we agree on the hunger thing.

No, we don't wash our hands of something difficult. We do what we can to remedy the plight of the North Korean people and accept the fact that we have done what we could given the circumstances.

An objectve mind would also see that today's Democratic Party does little more to aid the nation's poorest and sickest in spite of their rhetoric. Case in point would be the likes of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, John Kerry, Charlie Rangle, Barney Frank, etc.

Can you honestly state that the Democratic Party has followed a truly Christian approach? Given its stance on abortion how hypocritical does one have to be in order to say that they are a true Christian Democrat?

roundabout
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Feeding someone hungry...

....when you see them, has nothing to do with governments starving people in their governments---just use it as an excuse to keep all of the food.

N. Korea has a huge, well equipped army, the citizens can't do anything about their "leaders." Maybe we need to drop some more guys into their leader's homes?

Would they attack S . Korea? Would we attack them then? I had my fill of that.
(Keyboard screwed up---I corrected many letter omissions)

Spyglass
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IF I thought the aid would get to those who need it

I would be all for it. This is a tough situation, for sure.

suggarfoot
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Salvation Army has always done a good job

United Way is known for paying their people 1st, and bloated salaries, and if anything is left over...well then it goes to the masses.

Ninja Guy
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The Real Danger In Providing Food

to the North Koreans is that they will be exposed to socialism and all its evils! How can they ever hope to become part of the great capitalist society if they rely on food from the US government or on food handouts from private organizations, which exist only because of socialist programs run under the guise of 'tax-exempt' status! North Korea can be ground zero in the world-wide libertarian revolution! They have reached the nadir of John Gaultish Objectivism, so the only direction is up! We must not impede the great wave of capitalist affluence that is about to wash over North Korean people--the five that will be left after the famine! Randian Objectivism and the Gold Standard for North Korea or Die!

Better Dead Than Red!

Go Hawks!