Liberal Media lies, lies, lies

103 replies [Last post]
smoothassilk
smoothassilk's picture
Offline
Joined: 01/23/2008

http://www.sacbee.com/2012/09/24/4850143/2016-obamas-america-illegally.html

What a crock! I was scammed. Through the liberal media I learned that the move 2016: Obama’s America was scheduled to be on Fox News free. I spread the word. Boy was I stupid. This was too good to be true. An out and out lie from the Obama front, again.

I am also sick and tired of Hollywood producing propaganda films such as; The Lorax and The Dark Knight returns, which are still playing on the big screens today. Here is a quote that chilled my spine from the Dark Knight; “Don't talk like you're one of them! You're not... even if you'd like to be. To them you're just a freak, like me. They need you right now, but when they don't, they'll cast you out. Like a leper. See, their morals, their "code"... it's a bad joke, dropped at the first sign of trouble. They're only as good as the world allows them to be. I'll show you. When the chips are down, these uh, these "civilized people", they'll eat each other. See, I'm not a monster. I'm just ahead of the curve.” That scared me to death!

My family will not watch any longer listen to the lies of the lame liberal mainstream media any more. We will not be buying theater tickets any more. My family will be having our little boycott against propaganda, lies, liberal manipulation, and financially supporting Hollywood. We will continue to promote 2016: Obama’s America any way we can.

KCW56
KCW56's picture
Offline
Joined: 05/15/2008
Listening to Rush now on

Listening to Rush now on http://wabcradio.com/sectional.asp?id=32844

Rush blasted the Obama camp on the lie of 2016: Obamas America, lies to the nth degree...

He is now on how much golfing Obama does, more than Bush, and isn't doing his job as President or Commander and Chief!

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
Hey Smoothassilk, the guy

Hey Smoothassilk, the guy that sold you your spell checker scammed you too!

I think I bought mine from the same liar! 8 - )

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - Are you

posting as smoothassilk?

Talk about how to discredit the movie based on the book, it had to be you that posted this, right?

I know as soon as you finished The Law, you must have picked up The Roots of Obama's Rage. ;-D

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
PTC_0, not me, I’m not

PTC_0, not me, I’m not posting as anyone else. Just being Gort is enough for me!

To be honest, if I was forced to make a choice between reading the “The Law” or “The Roots of Obama's Rage” I would choose “The Law.”

In case you're interested, I hear the movie 2016, “Obama’s America” was scheduled to be on Fox News for free! Not sure how reliable that is, I read it in the funny papers. 8 - )

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - Hmmm

Just out of curiosity I searched to find out more about this movie.

http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=2016obamasamerica.htm

Seems there is a lot of interest in Mr. Obama and his background, $32 million and #2 on as the top political documentary of all time. I haven't seen the movie but I have read the book.....some of it is out there but even if this book is 50% right it's pretty damning.

It's interesting in particular why no one seems to remember Mr. Obama at Columbia University, not students, not professors, nada. I am not saying anything is wrong with this, a lot of students pass through a university without much notice, but a sitting President? Do you have any links that may address this issue?

smoothassilk
smoothassilk's picture
Offline
Joined: 01/23/2008
PTC Observer

Here's an article by Wayne Allyn Root

link http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/obama%E2%80%99s-college-classmate-...

Why do we vet candidates? Four years has gone by without providing documents from Columbia and Harvard to prove his innocence. Four million dollars has been spent to protect these documents. How does one get vetted without proof? It's amazing Obama finally came up with a birth certificate; another post battle of his eligibility to even be our current President.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/04/27/obama.birth.certificate/index.html

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
PTC_0, it’s about as

PTC_0, it’s about as believable as the notion he never attended Columbia.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/columbia.asp

Next spring that book will be available at many garage sales for a quarter! And overpriced at that! 8 - )

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - It

seems plausible enough to me, thanks for the link to snopes. A rather mysterious period in his past though don't you think? Not that I have the time but it would be interesting to know what his philosophy was at the time. Had he, for example, given himself over completely to socialist ideals by this time or did he develop those at Harvard? If anything, Mr. Obama is an interesting historical character and we should know a lot more about him than through his own eyes or his father's dreams.

Clearly, by his positions on free enterprise he has a surprising lack of understanding on how the financial/economic world works as do most leftists (except Mr. Krugman of course). This is why his results are so poor in this area and why we are in such peril because of it. A president that acts out on his political ideals is not necessarily a bad thing unless those ideals have been proven time and time again corrupt and without merit. The world has seen world wars fought, human destruction and suffering beyond description played out over the ideals of the president. You simply need to understand Mr. Obama's father's dreams to understand Mr. Obama's ideals.

Now a thought provoking question for you, do you think the war with Iran will come before or after the election? The answer is......

smoothassilk
smoothassilk's picture
Offline
Joined: 01/23/2008
PTC-O

Israels Prime Minister has asked to meet with Obama on several occasions after the Islamic Muslim Brotherhood terrorist attacks. Not to dismiss that this attack included the torture and execution of our American Ambassador. Obama and wife instead were on the View yesterday, campaigning. Obama said he is to busy to meet.

Meanwhile, Iran continues its nuclear warfare plan. Israel is overly concerned. Obama continues to ignore Israel. I pray that Israel can hold Iran off until the right man wins office. Once this war starts, we will have Russia, Iran and China involved.

The USA is believed to be weak in our military.

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
PTC_0, I can see how it could

PTC_0, I can see how it could be considered a plausible argument to a group of confused people. Me, I’m sticking with my own opinion.

Please don’t tell my 401K and IRA about President Obama’s,”…, lack of understanding on how the financial/economic world works, okay? They look so much better now, than four years ago.

Mmm…, do I think the war with Iran will come before or after the election? Your guess is as good as mine. My understanding is the war with Iran has already begun. Publicly we have economic sanctions strangling their economy and covertly we’re making cyber attacks and sabotage directed at their nuclear program. Is this not so?

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - Don't

count those dollars so quick, while you may seem richer now than you were before, the QE3 will take care of that problem. Economics Gort, when you print a whole lot of money, that money becomes worth less (worthless), which means to buy hard assets, like companies that actually produce things, it takes more of those worthless dollars to buy them. Hope I haven't lost you on this. Earnings are up too during the "recovery", but sadly the inventory and other crash corrections are over, so if you look around Gort you will now see a lot of earnings clouds on the horizon. So, take it from me, if you want to preserve your wealth, well you can't I am afraid. Hint: The reason gold has gone up through QE1, QE2, and now QE3 is not because it is worth more its because the dollar is worth less. Oil same thing. Commodities same thing. The prices you see at the store for downsized products at the same "old price" same thing. The price of food and energy same thing. So, feel good with your new found "wealth" it won't last long Gort.

Now, as to the Iranian question. Blood war Gort, when do you think it will start before or after the election?

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
PTC_0, why do you use so many

PTC_0, why do you use so many words to say you fear the effects of inflation? Gort knows enough about inflation to know that retail prices have more to do with “what the market will bear” than the cost of commodities. Your not suggesting I would be better off if I didn’t have a 401k and IRA?

I have no idea if Iran will escalate into a blood war before or after the election or even at all.

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - Inflation

I would suggest that none of us are better off and won't be in the future. I am also saying that you shouldn't use the Dow "increases" as an example of where Mr. Obama has been successful, when it is exactly the other way around. It is an illusion Gort.

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
PTC_0, if the Dow was down

PTC_0, if the Dow was down would you consider that a good thing? Isn’t the Dow a part of the Free Market reflecting investor’s confidence? Your not telling me the Free Market got it wrong, are you?

BTW, I only saw the headlines on PM Netanyahu's speech to the UN. The subtitles indicate no blood war this year. Is that the way you see it?

Robert W. Morgan
Robert W. Morgan's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/26/2005
500 points down between Nov 7 and 16

if the "free phone" President gets reelected. Many financial advisors are moving their clients into cash for the rest of the year - just in case it happens.

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - We

We don't have a free market.

I know this is complicated, but the up trend in the Dow is not driven by earnings as it should be, it's driven by monetary policy of the FED supported by this Administration. It will play out after the election in the form of lost wealth by every American and the devaluation of our currency.

The game is nearly over anyway Gort.

Then everyone will be asking, what happened?, with great surprise!

The blood war will happen after the election, no matter who wins.

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
PTC_0, what will it be like

PTC_0, what will it be like when the game is finally over, 2008?

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Gort - I am

I am afraid not, it won't be so good as 2008.

Gort my friend, we are in for a very rough time. Just like generations before us, most are blind to what is coming. The road we are on is not and never was sustainable.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
Dow Illusion

This entire so-called recovery is an illusion!

Up, up and away, in my beautiful balloon
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-09-27/how-crony-capitalism-or-undilut...

Reminds me of the children's game musical chairs, except when the music stops this time all of the chairs will be gone!

When the fiat currency finally collapses initially commodities will fall as well but hang on, keep stacking gold and silver. -GP

smoothassilk
smoothassilk's picture
Offline
Joined: 01/23/2008
Gort doesn't Obama just

show the proof. He was vetted right? We have a right to challenge Obama's eligibility to be the President of the United States. These challenges take place because we see no proof. Why is it that Obama can get away with this, when no one else can?

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
Smoothassilk, tell me the

Smoothassilk, tell me the truth, what proof would ever satisfy you? I doubt you even believe it yourself.

smoothassilk
smoothassilk's picture
Offline
Joined: 01/23/2008
Gort

Thanks, better?

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
Smoothassilk, it’s spelled correctly but

now the sentiment is all wrong!

If you’re going to write as a member of the lunatic fringe, the misspelled words would just add to your mystique. “Lier, Lier, Lier” does have a ‘home schooled’ sense of charm about it.

Perhaps you should consider putting it back the way it was?

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Gort!!

Trying to reason with those who only want to denigrate Obama is becoming folly. We'll see what happens Oct. 3. Even Romney's answer to 'what is your plan?' is vague. Hopefully we'll get to see the difference between what is being offered to the American people by Obama and Romney from their own words on the 3rd.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
Romey's "Vague" Plan ?
Davids mom wrote:

Trying to reason with those who only want to denigrate Obama is becoming folly. We'll see what happens Oct. 3. Even Romney's answer to 'what is your plan?' is vague. Hopefully we'll get to see the difference between what is being offered to the American people by Obama and Romney from their own words on the 3rd.

Calling Romeny's Plan "Vague" is more ridiculous leftist propaganda!

Romney the successful businessman will not pay your mortgage and he is not giving away phones but unlike community organizer Obama he does have a PLAN!

Here is a link to Romney's "Vague" 87 page plan, everyone should read it before they vote, I have and it is anything but vague:
http://www.mittromney.com/sites/default/files/shared/BelieveInAmerica-Pl... -GP

S. Lindsey
S. Lindsey's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/31/2008
Oh now GP you got to understand...

..that Progressives have to say Romney has no plan because if they actually say he does then the next obvious question is...WHAT IS OBAMA'S and if he has been using one for the last 4 years... IT AIN'T WORKING.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
Obama's Plan for America
S. Lindsey wrote:

..that Progressives have to say Romney has no plan because if they actually say he does then the next obvious question is...WHAT IS OBAMA'S and if he has been using one for the last 4 years... IT AIN'T WORKING.

Lindsey, are you so sure Obama's plan is not working?

If his plan is for America to be a third world country than he is right on course! -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP
Quote:

If his plan is for America to be a third world country

Please describe for us a 'third world country'. Thanks.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM

Please describe Obama's plan for America. Thanks.

If you don't know what a third world country is than either Google it or wait a few years(if O's reelected). -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

Nice evasive answer from a person who's afraid of a little 'color'. Our country - in no way can become a third world country economically or demographically in the next ten years - not matter who is president - and YOU KNOW IT!

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM
Davids mom wrote:

Nice evasive answer from a person who's afraid of a little 'color'. Our country - in no way can become a third world country economically or demographically in the next ten years - not matter who is president - and YOU KNOW IT!

You are a racist!

Where did I mention color?

Evasive answer? Open your eyes and do a little research with an open mind instead of your usual instinctual veer off into the tangent of "that's racist" BS.

Obama's destructive regulations and energy policies alone would fill a book! This man is using the EPA to SINGLE-HANDEDLY DESTROY the Coal Industry which produces almost half of our electricity!

Obamacare will evolve into single payer(read government) which will Nationalize 17 percent of the Private Sector in one swoop!

Obama prohibits through EPA regulations oil/coal/nuclear while he distributes cash to his cronies like Solyndra.

Obama has run up federal debt by Trillions, by next year it will be more than ALL PREVIOUS PRESIDENTS COMBINED!

Obama has cut our missile defense and is threatening to cut even more. And the list goes on and on.

I have some work to do right now but if you want I can post some more info later tonight. -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

Don't bother. I nor do many others, use your research as credible. We'll listen to the debates, figure out what the candidates answers mean to us and our families - and vote on November 6th. If you can't determine who 'them' are - and feel that the lady in the video represents the 47% mentioned by Romney- than I say you have racist tendencies - and are very likely to never celebrate the progress that Americans have made in race-relations in the last 20-30 years. Too bad some never learned to multi-task!! I know that was a problem for McCain.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM

First of all you must have me confused with someone else. Where did I use "them" and in what context?

Romney stated that his tax plan which will cut taxes for the middle class is of no use to 47% of the population that already pays zero taxes and I agree with him.

There are many that pay zero federal income tax, retirees, low wage workers, etc, not all are abusers of the system.

There is also a segment of our population( both black and white) that are users and abusers of government programs, is that what you are referring to by "them"?

BTW, I am no big fan of Romney as I disagree with many of his foreign policies (I am more of a Constitutional/Libertarian/Conservative blend) but he will get my vote due to the disaster that awaits us if Obama is reelected. -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

Well, maybe you can multi-task after all !!!

Quote:

There are many that pay zero federal income tax, retirees, low wage workers, etc, not all are abusers of the system.

Again, your credibility just was lowered another rung. Most of my friends here in Georgia are 'retired' - and honey, we file with the IRS every year!!!! That segment that you speak of does not include most retirees, most veterans, most seniors, and many low -wage earners who pay payroll tax every month and therefore should not be included at all in the 47% of those that support Obama and according to you pay zero federal income taxes. (By the way - that percentage is increasing that support Obama - but experience has taught me that it could just as easily change between now and November 6th.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM and Reading Comprehension

The quote above is stating that NOT ALL OF THE 47% THAT PAY ZERO TAXES ARE ABUSERS OF THE SYSTEM. Read it in context with the sentence before and after. -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

What part of the 47% pay zero taxes?

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM 47%

46.4% of American households paid no federal income taxes for 2011.

This 46.4% number is comprised of many different groups, among them are retirees and low income working families, THEREFORE, not all of the 46.4% are leaches on the government (I DO NOT consider low income and retirees leaches) and the portion of government entitlement users and abusers is LOWER than 46.4%. This was my point in a previous post and I apparently did not make it clear. I hope this makes sense to you now. -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

You made it clear now - but does Mr. Romney understand that of those who may pay zero income tax - not all are Obama supporters? (But he has already offended some who might have supported him. Apparently, he did not understand how his statement regarding those who pay no income tax would be perceived - IMO)

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM

DM I can't speak for Romney but I would bet he would like a do-over on that speech. -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

I may have mixed you up with KC , sorry- but why don't you share your views of the specificity or lack of specificity in the points that I posted from Romney's Plan. Thanks. There are a lot of citizens who have problems with some Libertarian viewpoints - because some of the Libertarians who profess to hold these viewpoints only want to implement them as long as their 'bias' is not dealt with. Why do you think the United States will be a Third World Country' if Obama is re-elected?

JeffC
JeffC's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/21/2006
Ridiculous leftist propaganda
Georgia Patriot wrote:

Calling Romeny's Plan "Vague" is more ridiculous leftist propaganda!

It's the hard right with the long knives carving up Romney:

John Podhoretz: "The Romney camp is ... too intent on winning over the small batch of uncommitted and independent voters by saying absolutely nothing that might possibly offend them."

Bill Kristol in the Weekly Standard: "Mitt Romney in particular will have to speak up. When a challenger merely appeals to disappointment with the incumbent and tries to reassure voters he's not too bad an alternative, that isn't generally a formula for victory."

Wall Street Journal's editorial: "Mr. Romney's pre-existing political calculation seems to be that he can win the election without having to explain the economic moment or even his own policies. As this flap shows, such vagueness carries its own political risks."

William McGurn, a former speechwriter for President George W. Bush: "Mr. Romney's reluctance to outline a thoughtful policy on Afghanistan does not make it go away".

National Review editor Rich Lowry: "There's a general sense on the right that a more substantive campaign would be better."

Jonah Goldberg branded the 2012 race as “The Campaign of Wrong Ideas vs. No Ideas.” Guess who had "No Ideas"?

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
JeffC - Well

we certainly know Mr. Obama's plan don't we?

We see the results everyday, I suspect that Mr. Romney's plan will be similar but different. In the end, it will be the taxpayers that lose, matter how you would like to slice and dice it.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
JeffC

I wouldn't call them "hard right", more like a list of Neocons and RINO's.

At any rate from what I hear, the hunting season for both opens on November 6th and there is no bag limit! -GP

Gort
Gort's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/28/2009
Dmom, the first debate is a

Dmom, the first debate is a good topic for a new blog. Thanks for the suggestion.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Here is Romney's Plan

I'm sure these issues will be brought up during the debate. I'm sure many questions regarding specifics will be asked - like what programs will be cut and how many citizens will lose jobs behind those cuts - and how will the savings be used to cut the deficit.

FIVE BILLS FOR DAY ONE

The American Competitiveness Act
• Reduces the corporate income tax rate to 25 percent
The Open Markets Act
• Implements the Colombia, Panama, and South Korea Free Trade Agreements
The Domestic Energy Act
• Directs the Department of the Interior to undertake a comprehensive survey of American energy reserves in partnership with exploration companies and initiates leasing in all areas currently approved for exploration
The Retraining Reform Act
• Consolidates the sprawl of federal retraining programs and returns funding and responsibility for these programs to the states
The Down Payment on Fiscal Sanity Act
• Immediately cuts non-security discretionary spending by 5 percent, reducing the annual federal budget by $20 billion

FIVE EXECUTIVE ORDERS FOR DAY ONE

An Order to Pave the Way to End Obamacare
• Directs the Secretary of Health and Human Services and all relevant federal officials to return the maximum possible authority to the states to innovate and design health care solutions that work best for them
An Order to Cut Red Tape
• Directs all agencies to immediately initiate the elimination of Obama-era regulations that unduly burden the economy or job creation, and then caps annual increases in regulatory costs at zero dollars
An Order to Boost Domestic Energy Production
• Directs the Department of the Interior to implement a process for rapid issuance of drilling permits to developers with established safety records seeking to use pre-approved techniques in pre-approved areas
An Order to Sanction China for Unfair Trade Practices
•Directs the Department of the Treasury to list China as a currency manipulator in its biannual report and directs the Department of Commerce to assess countervailing duties on Chinese imports if China does not quickly move to float its currency
An Order to Empower American Businesses and Workers
• Reverses the executive orders issued by President Obama that tilt the playing field in favor of organized labor, including the one encouraging the use of union labor on major government construction projects
orporate income tax rate to 25 percent
The Open Markets Act
• Implements the Colombia, Panama, and South Korea Free Trade Agreements
The Domestic Energy Act
• Directs the Department of the Interior to undertake a comprehensive survey of American energy reserves in partnership with exploration companies and initiates leasing in all areas currently approved for exploration
The Retraining Reform Act
• Consolidates the sprawl of federal retraining programs and returns funding and responsibility for these programs to the states
The Down Payment on Fiscal Sanity Act
• Immediately cuts non-security discretionary spending by 5 percent, reducing the annual federal budget by $20 billion

I'm sure we'll have many here who will tell us why we should support Romney's plan. On October 3rd, we'll even have more information!

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Charts that may be used in the debate
PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
Tax Policy Center vs. Heritage - DM

Thanks for linking those Washington Post - Tax Policy Center articles, here's the Heritage's rebuttal. Who you going to believe these days?

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2012/09/tax-policy-centers-skew...

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Thanks PTCO

But I find it a little difficult to rely solely on the Heritage Foundation and Rush Limbaugh. Thanks for the URL - I check on it frequently so that I can be ready for 'that' argument. We'll just have to listen to the debate, check with what few credible journalists/experts are left - and make up our own minds regarding who to believe.

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
DM - I find

it amusing to call the upcoming event a "debate", it clearly is anything but a debate. It is theatrics and nothing more than that.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
LOL PTCO

I'm sure there were those who said that about some of the 'Lincoln' debates - but some of the words from those debates we remember to this day. These two individuals are vying to represent the American people for the next four years at least. I hope some pay attention to their ideas for governance before they vote in November - or whenever they vote. I don't find the election process amusing or your idea of disenfranchising certain groups of Americans - I really pray that you are in a minority. . .but I do find your comments entertaining and sometimes challenging. Are most of your ideas based on the Libertarian belief system - or is it so-called neo-conservatism? I think you explained this before - and I'll look it up and ask more specific questions after I have clarified the two in my own thought. Someone once said - Life is a stage, and each one of us feels that he is the main character in a very important play!

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
DM - I've

told you before DM, that you need not worry about people like me. We are in the minority, we don't use the force of government to advance our views, we don't believe in armed rebellion, we believe in advancing our ideas through reason. We believe in limited government that protects individual rights to life, liberty and property. We believe in supporting that limited government with limited taxes. We believe in the individual and not the nanny state. We believe no matter how important our personal beliefs are, we can't use the force of government to advance them. We believe in a limited Armed Force to defend our vital interests against any enemy that would attempt to defeat our ideals. We believe in individual freedom to choose and not mob rule. Socially, I suppose you would call us "liberal" and fiscally I suppose Democrats would call us anything racists, radicals, the enemy within, you know the things you call me, very dull intellectually. The Republicans would call us pro gay, anti-marriage, baby killers, the anti-Christ, you know the things they call Democrats.

You seem to be most disturbed by the idea that we would limit the vote based on who you work for, but let's take a look at this position. One of the issues that you seem to have a very hard time with is the fact that billionaires and corporations "own" our politicians and the political process. The reason they own this process is because they wield financial power. A power that comes from the government itself. However, crony capitalism requires that government "payoff" on corporate and individual investments in the form of legislation that protects their interests or tax codes that provides loopholes.

Likewise, employees of governments as well as their extensions, contractors, etc. form special interests around their compensation. If for example a business had the same system, employees of the business would get to vote for managers that would increase their pay and benefits. Managers would be able to vote and force the board to pay them more based on how "happy" they made their employees. Clearly, a business operating under these conditions wouldn't last long.

However, in government they have an seemingly never ending source of funds call taxes and debt. Not only this, if things seem to be running out of steam, well they can just go print some more money to fool everyone into believing they are getting something right out of thin air. Your know like the recent run up in the Dow. Unfortunately, for us all, business can't exist under these conditions and neither can governments. The sand will finally run through the hour glass and our government will collapse. Exactly when this will happen no one really knows, but it will DM just like the sun rising in the East, it is inevitable, it's all in the numbers. It is all because we believe the government is the answer but it's not.

No DM, I am not a neo-conservative or a conservative, I am not a libertarian in the modern sense, I am just a person with ideas that are not new. They are threatening to you because you are a Democrat. You have a vested interest in continuing government sponsored programs and expanding them if at all possible. I am just as threatening to Republicans because they are conservatives. They simply want to keep things the way they are, except those programs that benefit Democratic interests and not their own.

The ideas that founded our country will never die, because they are based on Natural Law and God given rights. Rights that we all have no matter how hard we seem to try to suppress them using government, the right to life, the right to freedom, the right to property. To insure these rights we had a Constitution that established a Republic. A Republic no more, we are now a democracy and we are all poorer for it, all of us.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
PTCO - glance at

545

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
DM - It's not 545

It's not the 545, it's us.

Are you willing to give up all the social programs provided by government DM?

I suppose not, it's too much to hope and it will never change.

The sand continues to run.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
PTCO???

Never is a long time - and I've lived through a lot of changes in this country. We'll have the safety nets for the poor and unemployed - without the deficits - in time - because we're Americans. We've seen what not paying attention to those who govern can do - and we ELECT THEM. We are RESPONSIBLE for electing them. They are responsible for the action/inaction. As the reporter said - they are responsible for acting with integrity - and if they don't - we take them out!! Do we have the nerve to do that? Hmmmmmm. WE - not some privileged class of non-government workers.

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
DM - I am

afraid, you have missed my point.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
Debate Cheating?

The upcoming debate will be on Domestic Policy, it will be basically six preplanned questions, with each section being approximately 15 minutes long.

The first debate will be moderated by Jim Lehrer of PBS fame.

PBS is known for having all non-political reporters and not favoring any party or agenda...Right?

Does Obama already know the questions this time? http://theulstermanreport.com/2012/09/24/wall-street-insider-beware-the-...

Yes it is all Theatrics with certain people already equipped with the questions and possibly answers.

The question now becomes can Romney get Obama to venture off-script and since he is teleprompter free may we get a glimpse of the true Obama? -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Quote: may we get a glimpse
Quote:

may we get a glimpse of the true Obama? -GP

or the true Romney - as we did with the 47% episode. Interesting. We'll be watching for the 'facial expressions' the phony smiles' the 'exasperating ' gasps'. Yep - we're all on stage. Some of us have more responsibility than others. November 6 will tell us who we trust? or who we feel more comfortable with in the White House.

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
Obama Support

At least Obama has people supporting him in high government office http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2012/09/30/Hugo-Chavez-says-hed-vote-... -GP

Robert W. Morgan
Robert W. Morgan's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/26/2005
I would call this a good start, Mom- corporate tax should be 15%

but other than that, I'm fine with Romney's plan. What's not to like?
Might need to open up the fracking and some offshore drilling and get unemployment benefits cut back to 13 weeks, but he can do that in week #2.

You and so many like you think this race is all about, well - race, but it is not. Economic survival of the country is the single most important thing and should be the only thing the President focuses upon the first 3 months of next year. I firmly believe that if that President is Romney, he will do exactly that and there will be job growth and everything that goes along with that. I also believe if it is your guy - he won't do any of that and will think that a big decision is whether to go on Letterman of The View. This country will not survive 4 more years of Obama and that most certainly includes all these welfare programs and food stamps and Medicare and even social security. Get a grip Mom, need some leadership here - and quickly.

rolling stone
rolling stone's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/08/2012
Respectfully disagree Robert W. Morgan:
Quote:

This country will not survive 4 more years of Obama and that most certainly includes all these welfare programs and food stamps and Medicare and even social security

You are not giving the greatest country on earth enough credit. We survived 8 years of George W. Bush and company.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Rollingstone

I find it interesting that no one wants to directly address Romney's Plan - which I have shared verbatim from his website. (Just the highlights- as he described them) I guess everyone is like me - involved in Saturday football! I also find it interesting that they think that no one but them go to the 'talking points' that is shared for conservatives/Republicans to view. Throughout the web sphere - it's the same old thing. (The same old answers, etc.) Of course when dealing with me - it is easier to call me a 'racist' than to deal with the issue of Romney's Plan. Oh well . . . . . Ohio State is doing pretty good - but Michigan may get their touchdown! (But you've got to complete passes)

NUK_1
NUK_1's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/17/2007
DM: romney Plan

Not a lot to discuss....it looks like everyone else's plan: long on sloganeering and short on details. Whoooo! We're going to save 20 billion! Awesome!

The China-is-a-cuurency-manipulator is one part of Romney's platform that the media and Obama are way too timid to want to discuss. On this issue, I happen to 100% agree with Romney and I'm surprised that a lot of Dems who are not inclined to view "free trade" favorably aren't also jumping on this bandwagon under the guise of "fair trade." I guess it's because when we're running 1.5 trillion dollar deficits and someone besides ourselves has to buy that debt and it happens to be China, things get a little complicated for libs.

The DRILL DRILL DRILL bit always makes me LOL because what no Repub seems to understand is that oil pumped out of the ground HERE may in fact not be sold HERE. It is sold on the global marketplace to the highest bidder. This just in: that ain't US! It's China that is paying the highest premium for that oil and just because you open up more drilling HERE doesn't mean that suddenly the supply of oil increases and the price decreases. Nope, production gets cut in order to maintain the highest price possible. DUH, Repubs, DUH.

Of course, you ask most Repubs or TPers "where does the US get most of its oil?" and I can guarantee you that 90% will say something like "Middle East" instead of the correct answer(and has been for years), Canada.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
NUk

I think we have the same reaction to the Romney Plan. (Or any 'plan' at this point) It will be interesting how the candidates handle the 'China' situation.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/17/obama-ad-mitt-romney-china_n_18...

http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2012/09/28/161964890/in-ohio-oba...

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
NUK Energy

Making our country energy independent is one of Romney's stated goals.

In a world that draws closer to Armageddon every day this seems like a wise thing. As of right now we are so dependent on others, all it would take is a few shots fired in the right places and we could see gas prices doubled. In such a feeble recovery as we have now that would be disastrous.

I support an America Energy Plan that has our energy independence as it's goal.

Any Obama supporter care to chime in with his energy plan? Solar? Windmills?
Chipmunks on a treadmill? How about just have Ben Bernanke print each of us a few million? -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Difference in Energy? GP

Where?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bill-chameides/obamas-energy-plan-by-the_b...

http://www.energyjustice.net/content/obama-and-romney-unite-destructive-...

Thanks for your input.

We as Americans need to look at what is actually being proposed/accomplished rather than making sure a certain individual is not elected. Try it. It's Civics 101

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
Energy Plans
Davids mom wrote:

Where?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bill-chameides/obamas-energy-plan-by-the_b...

http://www.energyjustice.net/content/obama-and-romney-unite-destructive-...

Thanks for your input.

We as Americans need to look at what is actually being proposed/accomplished rather than making sure a certain individual is not elected. Try it. It's Civics 101

Actions speak louder than words. We already have four years of Obama's energy plan, where did it get us?

1)Gas prices doubled.

2) A push toward cap and trade where electricity rates will "necessarily skyrocket". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlTxGHn4sH4

3)An assault on the coal industry by Obama thru the EPA. http://www.speaker.gov/general/coal-country-editorials-blast-obama-admin...

4)Loans to Obama backers for unproven "green energy", Solyndra etc. http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/economic-intelligence/2012/06/19/sol...

Yes, America has seen Obama's Plan and it will be rejected on Nov. 3. -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

Do you have any original retort other than what is found on Conservative websites? We'll see how these responses hold up on October 3 - the first debate. Somewhere in the 'noise' is the truth. What is your opinion of the difference between the two plans?

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM

You accuse me of getting my thoughts from Conservative websites while you quote Ariana Huffington?

And you consider these Conservative websites?
1)Obummer in his own words on Youtube?
2)US News?
3)I'll give you Boehner would like to be known as a conservative but he is not even close, he is head of the house RINO.

WE already seen Obama's plan in action, now he is in "say anything to get elected mode".

Should be exciting without a teleprompter on Oct 3rd, maybe Obama will say something deep, like, "the police acted stupidly" or "Joe, we need to spread the wealth around" or "you didn't build that" .

Or maybe Romney can get under the skin of the arrogant narcissist? -GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
The difference between the

proposed energy plans?

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM Obama's Proposed Plan?

I don't care what Obama says he will do if we give him 4 more years, I don't trust the man, we already have 4 years to judge him on and he gets an "F"!-GP

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
GP

That's your right. But if you're curious, check the AJC or any other website. The information of comparison of 'stands' on issues is out there for all to see before the 'debates'. Actually, I posted the 'issues stand' of both candidates here some time ago. It is interesting how the discussion goes quickly to 'denigration' rather than why one doesn't trust or agree with a 'stand'. An informed electorate. I think that is the goal - right? Unfortunately many see who Romney's advisors are - Rove and Co. - and we know where that led us! I know that no minds will change here - but just sayin'

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
DM Obama's Plan?

DM, I am assuming you voted for Obama in 08, how about sharing what his plan was then and how it has worked over the past 4 years? After all he had both houses of Congress his first 2 years.

All I ever heard in 08 was vague platitudes like "Hope" and "Change", no real substance. The air will be clean, the oceans recede, change has come to America..Meaningless vagaries.

As far as advisers, who are Obama's advisers, David Axlerod? Cass Sunstein? Van Jones? How about reverend Wright? Thanks to the corrupt media Obama was never vetted.

You see I really don't care who his advisers are, he had his time and he FAILED miserably. He gets an "F", not 4 more years -GP

S. Lindsey
S. Lindsey's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/31/2008
GP ..DM doesn't recogize Progressive websites, as well ...

...Progressive. They fit her belief system..her ideology so as far as she is concerned they are mainstream.

NUK_1
NUK_1's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/17/2007
If Obama wins, think of the enormous mess he inherits

I sure wouldn't want to be President and inheriting this kind of carnage. Oh wait, he actually DOES want to inherit this fiasco and actually believes he knows anything remotely about turning this country around. I sure haven't seen any signs of that whatsoever.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
Nuk

We're still here!

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
DM - And

we will be here if Mr. Obama is elected again, the point DM is under what conditions will we live?

S. Lindsey
S. Lindsey's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/31/2008
Well maybe not PTCO... Durable Goods DOWN 13.2%

“The Commerce Department said Thursday that total durable goods orders fell 13.2 percent in August. That’s the biggest drop since January 2009 when the country was in recession. Aircraft orders fell by nearly 102 percent, pulling down the headline figure,” the Associated Press reports."

What the Mainstream media won't tell you is the Recession has turned into a Depression.. and we will feel it after November..

meanoldconservatives
meanoldconservatives's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/09/2008
GP

Speaking of gas prices doubling....I have been wondering about something. When Bush 43 was in office and gas prices went through the roof, all you heard from the left was Bush, Cheney, Halliburton. You know, Bush and Cheney let gas prices go up so Cheney's old cronies at Halliburton could get their pockets lined with cash.

Now, since gas prices have doubled under the Community Organizer, is Halliburton still receiving all that cash courtesy of Barry? Maybe he's using some of that for "Obama phones" to get some more votes in Cleveland and other needy areas? Or is that put into the redistribution pot? If not, whose pockets are Barry and Uncle Joe lining with it?

Georgia Patriot
Georgia Patriot's picture
Offline
Joined: 09/17/2010
It's Somebody Else's Fault!

Obama sounds more like Bart Simpson everyday, "I didn't do it!"

National debt has increased by 60% under Obama but he is only claiming 10%, blaming 90% on others! http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000087239639044435880457801627061470572...

Yes,the Dems are resurrecting "we inherited this mess" and "it's George Bush's fault" for 2012.

WE need to make this prediction by Obama come true in November:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCN5-ovvFL0 -GP

S. Lindsey
S. Lindsey's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/31/2008
Nuk..most are educated better then that...

...but then the TP's seem to be the whipping boys for all sides.
We import 15% from the "Middle East" and 10% from Saudi Arabia...Yes Nuk most of those "stupid" TPers do indeed know this.

However your simplistic view of drill baby drill is just that overly simplistic.

Oil is, in fact, a World commodity. You are correct...BUT...here is the difference.
1. The Laws of supply and demand are never more in play then in the World Commodities market. You cannot deny that a "STABLE" supply helps ease speculators fears of an Warlike Iran closing the Straits of Hormuz. To see a good example of that all you have to do is look at the Macro Market examples of World Commodities when Iran shakes their Sabre. Oil prices escalate exponentially every single time.

2. Drill BABY Drill is more a reality then myth.. Not to relieve the high gas price at the pump(although it can help to stabilize it)...BUT... to stimulate our economy.
Again another example is North Dakota. Their unemployment is the lowest in the Nation and their per capita earnings are skyrocketing.. WHY because of the drilling happening in the PRIVATE oil market.

So Nuk let say if 15-25% of oil that is shipped to us from our not so friendly "friends" ceased.. what would the price of oil be and what would our gas prices look like?

A stable market is a happy market and nothing like have a stable source of oil makes it happier.

Additionally Nuk let's look at the potential of an Oil embargo or World Conflict scenario.. There is no reason why we cannot simply send OUR oil to OUR refinerys for OUR use. If we have increased OUR own production by 15-25% then there is simply NOTHING the Middle East can do to hurt us but if they shut the tap off today what would happen?
Again look to the 1973-74 Oil crisis for an example of that scenario..Just a "threatened" oil embargo caused oil prices to skyrocket and prices at the pump to climb drastically. However, as soon as, the American people forced the Carter Administration to look towards our OWN production almost magically oil prices plumeted and gas was plentiful again.

You see Nuk a Nation is never more secure when we depend less on others (Government included) and depend more on ourselves.

NUK_1
NUK_1's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/17/2007
SL: Are u suggesting we nationalize oil exploration?

Because that's the only way to guarantee that oil drilled here is actually sold/bought here.

I'm all for oil exploration in ANWAR(should have done it years ago) and developing "our own" energy, but when you leave it up to multinational corps who care about themselves and stockholders and not which nation buys the product, I don't see it happening in a major, market-changing way. Other countries simply cut their production down because they have plenty of oil and only want to sell it at the greatest profit.

Simply put, China is a bigger market for oil companies than the US and India is right behind them. How do you convince them to stop selling oil at the highest profit margin there? How do you force OPEC to stop cutting production when they don't like the market price for a barrel of oil? Or, force OPEC to not sell it at the highest margin to China who has an insatiable demand for oil right now?

I've never met a TPer who knew that Canada and not the Middle East supplied most of the oil America imports, either. This is the same group of people that stared right into the reality of getting rid of piece of trash Harry Reid and ran Sharron Angle instead.Or idiot christine O'Donnell. Or Moron Joe Miller. You're giving this group a lot more credit than what I've seen.

AtHomeGym
AtHomeGym's picture
Offline
Joined: 01/18/2007
Nuk & Nationalizing

Damn, I was just arguing with myself about whether or not to say that very same thing! Point in fact--we are producing more gasoline now than ever before and most gets sold to the highest bidder, not distributed to our own market. I guess if push came to shove, we could deplete the Strategic Oil Reserve!

S. Lindsey
S. Lindsey's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/31/2008
Why in the World..

...would I be for Nationalization? Where do you two get that in anything that I wrote?

Why is it when people are questioned as to why their belief that drilling for our own resources is both futile and well.. stupid.. they almost always get defensive and make statements and claims not even expressed?

Nuk you need to meet the TPers I meet.. They could easily teach you about Free Market Capitalism. Remember all politics are local but then painting with a broad brush is the easiest thing to do.

NUK_1
NUK_1's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/17/2007
SL: Maybe that was too much of a generalization on the TP

OK, I'll grant you that they aren't as tunnel-vision and myopic everywhere, but they sure seem to me to be Repubs who care as much about social issues as they do fiscal or foreign. That to me is a non-starter, but that's me. They jsut sound like a bunch of Repubs saying nothing new and advocating the same old tired crap that they themselves don't believe.

As far as oil exploration and drilling goes, I don't see any explanation from you about how if we drilled the hell out of everything tomorrow that gas prices are suddenly going to go down. forget suddenly...how about in a decade even? There won't be a sudden surplus when the oil market doesn't resemble anything like a "free market." It's highly controlled by oil-producing countries and when output gets too "high" and prices too "low" for their liking, they cut production.

The point is still this: you can drill in ANWAR(good) or right outside the beaches on the Gulf Coast(stupid) and what compels any of the companies doing this drilling to sell it here and not abroad, especially when abroad they pay more for it than we do and that isn't going to change?

PTC Observer
PTC Observer's picture
Offline
Joined: 04/23/2007
NUK_1, So

You don't believe in supply and demand, forecasted by futures?

BTW, OPEC produces 40% of the world's oil supply and they all cheat on their production numbers. High oil prices are caused primarily by depreciated fiat currency. Gasoline prices the same, plus restricted refinery production caused by the Clean Air Act, thus causing increased costs for sea transport of fuel supplies back to the US. Increased oil drilling would decrease future prices almost immediately but not gasoline prices. They will remain higher longer than falling oil prices, they will and do lag those prices.

S. Lindsey
S. Lindsey's picture
Offline
Joined: 12/31/2008
Nuk you need to re-read

I never said it would bring down gas prices.. I believe I said stabilize...

rolling stone
rolling stone's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/08/2012
Davids mom

The Republicans could not care less about Romney's Plan. During the primary is was "Anyone But Romney", but since Mitt landed the role, it is "Anyone But Obama". So what, it would not be the course of action anyhow. I am amazed when I do a search of the Republican "flavor of the day" rant to see the plethora of sites with the exact same thing; little wonder it is refered to as a echo chamber. They do like consistancy. Their dealings with you are also quite revealing with the degree of angst displayed over race. You have been quite consistant and transparent about your views, calm and respectful in your presentations, so a reasonable person would think that simple disagreement would surfice.

Davids mom
Davids mom's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/30/2005
You're absolutely right Rollingstone

. . and what is being demonstrated to those who are not participating, but just observing - is that when one is insecure in his/her stand - they just may resort to denigration/name calling/ etc. There are many issues that could be intelligently disagreed with - but one does have to have that information and understand why the disagreement. Some here have been quite clear and intelligent in their responses - and moved on. It is entertaining and educational for those who are observing (Civics 101) to see the fallacy in some of the arguments. Great football this weekend!!!!

Robert W. Morgan
Robert W. Morgan's picture
Offline
Joined: 10/26/2005
No, falling rock, we have not survived 8 years of George Bush

Not yet, nor will we until we get 8-12-16 years from Romney/Ryan. That might fix the problem.
Yes, in 16 years, I will be almost 80, but more to the point, President Paul Ryan will only be 58 and popular enough to try for a third term. Or, Obama wins in 2012 and we all lose everything.

Bush was not a conservative, he was simply a President who liked power and got into the spending thing way too much. He actually enabled Obama with TARP the way a crack dealer gives out free samples. Obama, of course is a crackhead when it comes to big government and big spending. He's still high right now. So are his crack h******'s in Congress.

Yes, the "what about Bush" morons actually have a point, but none of that solves the problem - does it?

Sure, Bush started it. So what? Let's end it. Obama needs to go away and quickly.

rolling stone
rolling stone's picture
Offline
Joined: 07/08/2012
Robert W. Morgan, I value your predictions

Since you are incorrect nearly 100% of the time, I feel good about the future.