Gas carts, bikers: Both involve rights

Daniel Allen’s letter on Sept. 29 both resonates and disturbs me. I agree with him that residents with gas-powered carts should not have to worry about a vote to outlaw them.

That issue is to me, an example of our council hard at work on a non-issue.

While I don’t like gas powered carts, the noise or their smell, I don’t support taking that right away.

Unfortunately, Mr. Allen shows his ignorance about cyclists by assuming road bike cyclists could use the cart path system instead of our local roads. Furthermore, the issues are not even related. Mr Allen seems to trying to make an issue out of nothing, much like the council.

The cart paths are fine for recreational riding, but not for training for competitive cycling. I doubt Mr. Allen has ever ridden a competitively designed road bike.

Mr. Allen, I’ll support your gas-powered cart. Leave me and my fellow cyclists out of this. Making connections that don’t exist between two separate issues doesn’t help your argument. It seems to me you just don’t like cyclists. Perhaps you should take my approach and support others’ rights to do something you don’t agree with and wouldn’t do yourself.

Share the road.

Rick Sanderson

Peachtree City, Ga.

rbertram1
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Rights

I agree with Dawg. If you drive poorly, then you can have your license taken away. If you bike poorly, besides perhaps a minor traffic violation (which never happens), there are virtually no repercussions. The bottom line is that cyclists are endangering the lives of both themselves and others by biking on the roads. Whether or not you bike safely is not the question; the fact that there are many who bike unsafely essentially ruins it for everyone.

The Dawg
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Share the Road?

A few years ago I was teaching my 15 year old daughter to drive. We were traveling through Peachtree City on one of the back roads and came up behind a cyclist. She slowed down and followed until it was totally safe to pass this road hog that was riding closer to the middle of the road than to the side. Yes being a new driver she stayed behind him a little longer than I would have but she was nervous. As we passed he cursed us to no end. If I hadn't been with my daughter I would have stopped and confronted this guy.

If cyclists want to "share the roads" they should have to license their bikes just as we have to license our cars. Tags should be placed on the bikes so that they can be reported to police if they are breaking any laws. And the money from this license should be used to widen the roads so that bike lanes can be created. I've seen this done in other places. (The bike lanes) I think that cyclists should only be allowed on the roads that have them.

Spyglass
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Clueless comes to mind..

Just saying..

normal
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Biker pigs

I almost killed one on Robinson. I was pulling out from the stop and he ran the stop sign coming in front of me. Huckleberry dumb ass. He was lucky I looked left again or he would have been DRT. Now going down ebenezer yesterday 2 bikers side by side taking up the whole lane and 2 more in front of them side by side taking up the whole lane. All the cars had to go in the opposite lane to get by. When they get run over it will be just to damn bad. No sympathy for them from this driver.

Courthouserules
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normal

I can't go along with "biker pigs." these people aren't pigs--most spend a lot of money.
You don't really want to run over the bikers or anyone else. You will tied up in court for years.

What I must explain to you, something I learned a long time ago, is that is is extremely difficult for a biker (bicycle) to stop fully or even slow much at an intersection or anything else.
If they so much as lose one heart-rate beat by relaxing or stopping the whole darn ride is ruined!

They must reach 120 beats a minute and hold that for a given number of minutes or hours for it to be effective. They would also have to lie in their social life, saying" my ride was wonderful today."

It would be wrong for you to spoil all that.

G35 Dude
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Not Pigs

I agree Court they are not pigs. But I also agree that when they're riding that they are only concerned with themselves and their perceived rights. Don't dare say anything to them or you'll get the finger. I know. *LOL*

Spyglass
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You treat someone out of line on the highways..

and you are likely to get the "finger" from them. I don't care what they are driving/riding on.

Treat them with respect, and generally, you'll get respect back. Works that in life MOST of the time. As always, there are exceptions.

Cyclist
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G35 Dude

I'm curious, what do you say to them?

G35 Dude
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Not going there!!!

Cyclist:"I'm curious, what do you say to them?"

Oh no. I've seen you on this board. You're one of those people that think the way to win an argument is to outlast your opponent. And I don't have the time or energy.

Courthouserules
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cyclist

Bet I know!

He honks his horn long and loud.

I have a question: Do you expect that a car or bus coming up behind you while you are on a bike to swing into the Left lane to miss you and give you plenty of room?

I had a strange situation last week with a bike rider:
As I approached a bile rider from behind him, I was going to turn right in about 3-400 feet, and there was a double line in the 2-lane road.

There also wasn't enough room to pass him before going by my turn and missing it.

So I slowed and waited until he went past my right turn then I turned.

He was angry that I followed him that far--could tell by his turning and frowning.

And, yes I had my right signal on.

I could have crossed the double line and roared around him possibly and screeched to a halt and made my turn---but I think then he would have thrown a rock at me!

He should have pulled off the road--there was room. Bikes don't belong on main streets and highways! Still wrong even if legal. Especially for kids.

Cyclist
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Courthouse - On Passing

The expectation is for the burden vehicle - that would be the passing vehicle - to be able to pass safely. Safely means that the burdened vehicle has to ensure conditions are such that the passed vehicle and those in the opposite or head-on lanes are not put at risk. This is part of the uniformed vehicle code that is consistent throughout the realm.

A bicycle, by definition, is a vehicle. I know that several on this board would disagree but that's the codified law. As a vehicle, a bicycle is afforded the protection as defined by the applicable traffic codes. So yes passing a bicycle requires the same due diligence as passing any other vehicle.

As far as the double-line or no passing zone, there's not much to do about that. Some, including state troopers, will pass a cyclist while a very few others will hang back until they have the broken line. Regardless of the scenario it's incumbent on the passing vehicle to able to do so safely.

Let me ask you this, do you pass mail vehicles as they are stopping along the road depositing mail in the boxes? Do you do so safely? Do they slow you down? Do you get upset about that?

As for your specific scenario, I'm sorry you had to slow; however, remember that there several hundred other things that can slow you down. Heck when I pull my trailer down to the beach especially on two lane roads like US 431 through Alabama or 331 through Florida I've had crazy people pass me in a no passing zones because they are in such a hurry and I'm doing the speed limit. Sometimes they would blare their horns or shout out something stupid - what low “lifes”.

I'm glad you had your signal on but did you honestly expect the cyclist to get off the road so you can pass him? Why?

Courthouserules
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cyclist: bikes

I was aware of what you said---all of it. I agree same rules apply.
I didn't mind slowing down for a block or so, the bicycle rider was upset, not me!

You didn't mention that!

As to mail trucks, I treat them the same as bicycles, unless they are completely out of my lane. I might toot my horn then. They have a job to do and the government allows them to do it.

As to the bicycle rider getting out of the right hand lane onto the shoulder if a double marker exists, he will just have to let me follow him as far as it takes without getting teed off!

Actually up until I quit riding bicycles at about 16 or so, I was taught that if a car or truck came up behind me on a two lane road to get the dickens out of the road!

It is the same thing as having to follow a person in a car doing 25 MPH on a two lane road with double lines!

The whole point being here is this: The bikers have no more rights than car drivers and should use their head to give in once in a while when it appears the right thing to do! They don't now for the most part.
I think you know that!

I think it is stupid and selfish to do otherwise!

Cyclist
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CHR$

I suspect you stop riding a bicycle back when the earth was cooling off and they taught you to ride against traffic. ☺

Anyways, you are right about one thing, cyclists have no more rights than car drivers. But think of this was, bicycles are traffic.

Courthouserules
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cyclist

Must have had a few beers, huh?

Getting hard to understand you today:
"you stop riding"
"think of this was"

Bicycling here is a lot like "dodge ball" to me!
Kids come close to death (6-10 years old) several times a day on my street within a subdivision.
Why would their parents teach them better when they act a fool on the main streets?

Cyclist
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Gee Dawg

Is that the only story you have? It's getting old. I have seen countless accidents over the years because people are not paying attention when they drive or do outright stupid things. I suspect you have seen it as well.

As for the license and tag thingy; good luck. I'm beginning to think that the whole idea of placing tags on motor vehicles is getting to be a joke. I mean after all how many times have you come upon a vehicle that has its tag obscured by a hoveround or with a receiver type luggage rack which has luggage on it.

Now as for the money thing, I'll let on a little secret just between the two of us; our property taxes maintains the county roads. Now while the ad valorem taxes we pay on our automobiles is kind of like a "property tax" there is no valid way for the county or the state to determine the value of bicycles since the value varies so much.

As for cyclists breaking law, absolutely they should be accountable just like other road users. In fact, I wish this was done more frequently.

I'll leave you with this. When was the last time you reported a motorist that broke the law?

BTW, I wouldn't do the confronting thingy as there's a state statue that you could run afoul with;

§ 40-6-397. Aggressive driving; penalty

(a) A person commits the offense of aggressive driving when he or she operates any motor vehicle with the intent to annoy, harass, molest, intimidate, injure, or obstruct another person, including without limitation violating Code Section 40-6-42, 40-6-48, 40-6-49, 40-6-123, 40-6-184, 40-6-312, or 40-6-390 with such intent.

(b) Any person convicted of aggressive driving shall be guilty of a misdemeanor of a high and aggravated nature.

It simply ain't worth it.

The Dawg
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Entitled Cyclists
Quote:

Is that the only story you have? It's getting old.

No but it makes my point as to how cyclists think they own they road. And I see you don't seem to have any problem with the way the cyclists acted. Maybe that was you?

Quote:

As for the license and tag thingy; good luck.

Well there needs to be a way to id a cyclist to the police other than a guy in spandex,goggles and bike helmet. As to the last time I reported a motorist. A few moths ago when I saw a drunk driver that couldn't stay on the road. I would have reported this cyclist also.

Quote:

Now as for the money thing, I'll let on a little secret just between the two of us; our property taxes maintains the county roads. Now while the ad valorem taxes we pay on our automobiles is kind of like a "property tax" there is no valid way for the county or the state to determine the value of bicycles since the value varies so much.

The idea is not to tax on the value of the bike but to help provide a place for the bikes to ride safely. Have you seen this?:

http://www.ajc.com/news/car-versus-bike-crash-670291.html

Notice that the motorist has not been charged.

As for confronting that would not have involved a vehicle of any kind. It would have been man to man. And yes I might have gone to jail. But........

Cyclist
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Dawg: How about entitled cagers

You know the ones that think they own the road like driving slow in left lane. How about that ones that pull right out in front of you even when there is no traffic behind you. I can go on and on about these yo-yos. You by chance are not one of them are you?

As for your claim that I have no problem with the actions of other cyclists, did you not see where I acknowledged that they should be accountable just like other road users? Or did you just conveniently overlook that?

Now for your silly tax exercise that you propose; do you have any idea how much it cost to buy the right of way in order to increase a roadway’s span? I didn’t think so.

Yes I have seen that unfortunate incident and charges are pending. Distracted driving is a danger to us all. Regardless of what happens in criminal investigation there will be a civil case out of this. I suspect the outcome will be the same as this one:

Jury Returns $3.4 Million

Your claim that you turned in a drunk driver is commendable. However, do you call the police any time you witness someone breaking a traffic law, and if you did what are the police going to do about? They did not witness it and you are not a sworn officer.

As for the confronting thingy, if you feel so strong about confronting someone on a bike that you feel did you wrong but not do the same to another motorist then, you have some anger management issues that you need to address.

The Dawg
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Nice dodges Cyclist
Quote:

You know the ones that think they own the road like driving slow in left lane. How about that ones that pull right out in front of you even when there is no traffic behind you. I can go on and on about these yo-yos. You by chance are not one of them are you?

Maybe, but I'm paying an tax to drive on the rode. And I have a license that can be revoked if I break the law. And a tag that you can use to report me.

Quote:

As for your claim that I have no problem with the actions of other cyclists, did you not see where I acknowledged that they should be accountable just like other road users? Or did you just conveniently overlook that?

Nice try. But my claim was that you had no problem with the actions of the cyclist in my story. Furthering my contention that you guys feel entitled. Nice dodge.

Quote:

Your claim that you turned in a drunk driver is commendable. However, do you call the police any time you witness someone breaking a traffic law, and if you did what are the police going to do about? They did not witness it and you are not a sworn officer.

Again nice dodge. Rather than address whether or not some form of id should be affixed to the bike you choose to attack the author of the idea.

Quote:

As for the confronting thingy, if you feel so strong about confronting someone on a bike that you feel did you wrong but not do the same to another motorist then, you have some anger management issues that you need to address.

Wow, do you ever address the question directly? Very few things make me that mad. But an adult cursing one of my kids is one. I guess if someone cursed one of your kids you'd run and hide? Thought so.

Cyclist
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Dawg

Maybe, but I'm paying an tax to drive on the rode. And I have a license that can be revoked if I break the law. And a tag that you can use to report me.

As well as I. As for the tag thing; just answer me this, do you report all traffic offenders to the police?

Nice try. But my claim was that you had no problem with the actions of the cyclist in my story. Furthering my contention that you guys feel entitled. Nice dodge.

Will I guess you’re just too proud to admit that you are wrong. I guess you'll have to live with that.

Again nice dodge. Rather than address whether or not some form of id should be affixed to the bike you choose to attack the author of the idea.

Did I attack you? Gee I though it was an exercise in trying to get you to logically apply your thought. Would it help if I typed slower so you can understand?

Wow, do you ever address the question directly?

What question? Well let’s just re-read your post and look for the questions. I’ll type slowly so you can follow….

Question 1: Maybe that was you?

Well have to admit I didn’t answer that one but, no it wasn’t me.

Question 2: Have you seen this?:

I believe I answered that one.

Well that’s all the questions you asked. So what other questions are you referring to?

Very few things make me that mad. But an adult cursing one of my kids is one. I guess if someone cursed one of your kids you'd run and hide? Thought so.

No, I don’t run and hide as I have already explained to them that people sometimes act irrationally. The difference between you and me is that you re-enforce being irrational by your actions. And as you stated, you can go jail.

The Dawg
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I know you now.

I guess the big question was do you approve of your fellow cyclist's actions. You will not answer. That and the fact that you will not stand up for your family tells me all I need to know about you.

Cyclist
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Ok Dawg

I guess the big question was do you approve of your fellow cyclist's actions. You will not answer.

I'm assuming you are referring to the one cyclist incident that you are fixated on. No I don't approve of that behavior. But like I said people act irrational. That includes cagers, pedestrians, politicians, cyclists, lawyers and now judges.

Spyglass
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Keep fighting the good fight, Cyclist..

good work.

Cyclist
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Thanks Spyglass!!!

This is why I got started on The C.

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