Todd’s cost-savings equal bigger class sizes

Last week, Dr. Bob Todd, a sitting school board member, gave us his observations regarding our school system’s financial position, his speculation of cause, and a general promise to fight the people and policies that have resulted in one of the top school systems in the state.

In 2009, our system educated a child for approximately $8,800, 53 percent of which or $4,700 of which, are paid by the taxpayers of Fayette County. $3,900 (44 percent) is paid by the state of Georgia. The average student in Georgia received approximately $4,400 in a combination of Quality Basic Education Funding (QBE) and local “equalization grants.”

Dr. Todd observes that Fayette County could maximize its funding by “changing enrollments.” Simply put, we can get more state dollars by maximizing class size in contradiction to our proven method of smaller class size that contributes to our success.

Regarding the elimination of certain programs such as art, music, and PE, Dr. Todd stated, “Elementary school — art, music, p.e. — in some instances, may need reducing ...”

Many would argue that the presence of these programs is part of our “Fayette Advantage.” To be clear, these programs (art, music, K-1st grade parapros, school nurses in every school, and school resource officers) are not required by the state of Georgia and are funded with our local tax dollars. We could save money by reducing these programs, but at what cost to our students?

Counting River’s Elementary (that Dr. Todd voted to build), we have 18 elementary schools to cover the nearly 200 square miles we call Fayette County. The location of these schools reflects a strategy of neighborhood elementary schools that minimize transportation time and maximize the opportunity for community involvement.

Not only is Dr. Todd convinced the bigger class size approach is a winning strategy, he is also troubled about our supposedly “excess classroom space.” The plain English translation of “excess classroom space” is too many schools. Nearly all of this “excess capacity” is in our elementary schools.

If you agree with Dr. Todd’s observation, the reasonable path of action is to close elementary schools.

A cursory analysis would consider the three oldest, Brooks, Peachtree City, and Hood; or the three with the most “excess capacity,” Brooks, North Fayette, and Spring Hill. Either of these actions would result in our elementary school utilization rate over 90 percent, affect thousands of families through the ripple wave of redistricting, and would better align our currently excellent system with the educational warehouse strategy practiced by school systems with worse performance and results than our quality Fayette County Schools.

I do not believe the closure of schools is the correct course of action.

When we compare the cost of educating a student in Fayette County to the rest of the state of Georgia, Fayette County’s spending is below average except for the cost of instruction.

In the category of instruction, we spend more than average per student by less than 1 percent. Given our results, I think that 1 percent extra has yielded a great return. We spend $659 more per student than Coweta County overall, but $714 (more than 100 percent) is on instruction.

When compared to school systems of similar size (13,000 to 29,000), Fayette spent less than the average in every category except instruction (+2 percent) and school administration (+4 percent). Given my experience as a first-time school parent, school administrators cannot be valued enough. My personal thanks to Mrs. Berryman and Mrs. Oot at PTC Elementary!

It is concerning that Dr. Todd’s letter reflects a strong dissatisfaction with more than just a few decisions that he himself was part of. With 20/20 hindsight, I believe that building Rivers Elementary was not a good idea. But, Dr. Todd voted for that and even attended the groundbreaking, no less.

Most alarming is his determination that a fundamental change in the direction of the entire system is necessary. Given Fayette County School’s many years of achievement, including being the only school system in Georgia to have every school achieve the U.S. Department of Education’s No Child Left Behind Program’s Adequate Yearly Progress, AYP, for every year of the program’s existence, it would seem the only direction to change to would be down to a lower standard of excellence.

Dr. Todd insinuates that instead of having excellent schools at a lower than average cost as proven above, he would be willing to trade the proven Fayette advantage of quality schools for a lower cost equivalent. As we all know, you get what you pay for.

Neil Sullivan

NeilSullivan72@gmail.com

Peachtree City, Ga.

Veritas
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Neil Reposted just for you I think you just really dont have a..

Clue ...

I’m glad you took your time to try and get your numbers from Smola together and in order. First, one knows that averages are used to cover or hide deficiencies. Secondly the last I checked there is not a university system nationwide that takes CRCT scores or the GHSGT (which are state tests and not nationally normed). As such let me explain that a reference test (CRITERION REFERENCE TEST) is a test of the school to determine if the correct curriculum is being taught to the students and NOT a measure of an individual student’s abilities. Now, the state of GA, in its infinite wisdom has misused these results to determine whether or not a student progresses to the next grade. Since none of Fayette County’s students are going to need a career tech track and they are all going to 4 yr Universities these institutions preferred method of scaling a students ability is to use the SAT or ACT and transcripts as guides to admission. So this brings me once again to why only 2/5 of Fayette county high schools score above the national average on the College approved SAT test as opposed to all of Coweta county high schools.
I also read your implication with great dismay that through supposition and hearsay that you believe that Dr. Todd would take away Gifted or AP programs seeing as he is the one who more than twenty years ago helped propose and initiate the implementation of the Secondary gifted program in Fayette County as one did not exist prior to that time. I deal in facts you claim this but only use supposition and hearsay. So, run, run quick as the wind, back to Smola. I await your reply with baited breath.

P.S. I’m glad you went to such pains to compare to a similar system unlike when you pushed for your E-Splost. Shows your growing ;-}

P.S.S
You obviously know little to nothing about the Career -Tech program and you are not aware that many “college bound” students do want and do take Career Tech Classes. There are presently many honor grads participating in them. Wildcat has already pointed out several of the offerings and the opportunities provided I will reiterate them for you.
1. The Engineering Program is one in which students have won a $10,000 grant from MIT and they also participated in a summer program at MIT. Schools such as MIT and Ga. Tech like their students to have this course. They know what they learn there.
2.The Health Occupations class is for students who are interested in the medical field. These students do Clinical rotations in different capacities within a hospital. They also are in paid work based opportunities with doctors. One of our honor graduates who plans to be a doctor recently completed a work based “internship” with Southern Orthopedics
3.The Graphics Arts program has a complete printing and graphics set up. They do printing for the county. These students have won the National Skill USA award in graphics One of these graduates in now attending Yale University.
4. The Family Consumer Science program serves students interested in the Hospitality Industry, Interior Design, Nutrition, and others. This also the program for students interested in teaching careers. Students take courses like Contemporary Issues in Education and work with mentoring teachers. They can also receive college credit for one of their classes. One goal of the program is to provide more teachers for Georgia.
5. In the Marketing program students work with companies like Chic-Fil -A and Cousins Properties They create and use surveys and create and use webpages. They also use online distribution.
6. Under the Career Tech Program an A P Accounting class will soon be offered.
These are not all of the offerings if you care to learn more there are people who can tell you about them
.
Under the Seal of Endorsement Diploma which has been in place for some time students have the flexibity of taking upper level math and science and participate in these programs as well as take courses in art music and foreign language. It is under that diploma that we became the #1 school system in Georgia. Under the new graduation requirements they are going to be more limited in their options As Labor Department Reports show 7 out of 10 jobs now and in the future will require technical training. Our new state mandate will limit students’ options. We could be short changing our students of profitable opportunities. There is little to no flexibilty with the new math mandates. Students needing and wanting higher math will still get that as they always have. Others who are less proficient can be thrown into situations for which they are not ready which will not be good for them or other students sharing those classes. These Career Tech classes are not second rate situations as you imply. One only needs to examine them to know that. AS far as funding is concerned Federal money supports those classes so these programs actually generate money for the system. ’
You have a Great evening :-}

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AnnieC. Checked facts REALLY??

If you checked facts on other than mundane day to day business votes and on the more important issues more often than not Dr. Todd voted against Smith Smola and Wright. ( This is where you will find the 3-2 votes in board meeting minutes take a look at what was being voted on. So please refrain from misrepresenting fact with .

Did you know that in one year Fayette County high Schools have dropped from 6 to 20 slots on the GHSGT in One year. All you have to do is go to the GADOE web.

Betcha didn't know Mcintosh used to be Number 1 in Ga.
Do a little more research and some real interesting facts will come about.. like who was the Secondary Curriculum director in Fayette County at the time when Fayette was Really at the top of the charts..

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I think Todd was wrong to

I think Todd was wrong to vote with the board, and he agrees. I'm voting for Todd because I believe he is the only thing standing in the way of Smola/Smith continuing to control the board. I feel they have been disastrous for our schools and will continue to destroy what we've built if Charlie Cave is elected. I believe that large balance from last year was built on the backs of employees and was the result of bad accounting from Laura Brock, not because the BOE, the superintendent, or the comptroller were doing something right. The numbers are clearly bad as the differences from month to month make no logical sense.

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I wonder, though, if Todd

I wonder, though, if Todd regrets *consistently* voting with the board, and if it's accurate to say that Smith/Smola are controlling it if Todd has been voting with them so regularly. It's easy to say you regret something if it makes you look a little better to constituents.

I personally think Smith and Smola and the rest of the board have done a good job with what they've been given; I don't understand all the vitriol towards them on here.

Suzie
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They DO Control the BOE

They wouldn't be smearing Bob Todd left and right if they weren't afraid they might lose control. They started their smear campaign against him because Lee Wright decided no to run for reelection and suddenly they didn't have a solid 3 vote majority. I simply don't believe you when you say you've followed the doings of the BOE if you don't know that Smola/Smith control the board. It isn't a matter of supporting one side or the other, it is basic numbers. They control the board, this has never been disputed by either side.

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I believe Bob Todd started

I believe Bob Todd started the smearing and has, in fact, based his entire campaign around it!

Of course I realize that the 3 do form a controlling majority; however, if Todd is consistently siding with them during votes then they're not really exercising that majority to his detriment, are they?

I should disclose that Terri Smith is a family friend, but I try not to let that color my judgement- I don't respect Todd because of his tactics, not just because those tactics are aimed at someone I know.

There's no reason for all the name-calling and mudslinging in this election. Obviously, all these people are on/running for the school board because they want to ensure that the children in this county get the best education they can. There's no other viable reason to do it and I respect all of them for wanting to do it so badly-- including Dr. Todd, although I don't agree with his incendiary campaigning tactics and do not plan to vote for him.

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Check your facts again on on who started the smearing and mudsli

Check your facts again on on who started the smearing and mudslinging read the articles and posts and dates.
So me a quote of Dr. Todd using these unsavory tactics of which you speak.

And also 3-2 votes on things of importance and not the day to day votes

3(SMITH SMOLa WRIGHT) 2 (KEY and TODD) To the schools and students detriment.

Courthouserules
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School Board

I don't care who is on the school board!
What is all of this about anyway? I know one lawyer wanted his kids to go to a school he wanted them to go to, but he should have gone to the BOE meeting and convinced them-----not necessarily help elect someone who won't change it!
This "friend" thing is getting bad in Fayette County. Especially in the Courthouse---and now the Board of Education!
I know developers, lawyers, builders, bankers, etc., are friends-in-"progress," but we need the law and schools to counteract that situation.

It took 100 years to clear up crooked sheriffing in Georgia---surely remnants don't still exist?

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He Started It? This is not elemetary school.

I appreciate that you have disclosed your relationship with Terri, and I'm sorry, but I do believe it has colored your opinions. I suggest you listen to the podcast of the infamous BOE brawl and the subsequent meeting. Smith/Smola very clearly and deliberately baited Dr. Todd in that meeting, and then the first two public comments at the next meeting were from people who have never, ever attended a BOE meeting before, and still saw fit to castigate Dr. Todd, with Charlie Cave sitting in the back smirking and whooping it up. One of those people, Joy Clark, insinuated she was a teacher in Fayette, which turned out not to be true. She was also exposed as having ties to Terri Smith. It defies logic to believe that Terri Smith did not instruct Ms. Clark to go to that meeting. FYI, she has not been to another meeting since then. Smola/Smith also threatened Dr. Todd with filing an ethics violation, which neither of them have followed through with. This is also public record, so you don't have to take my word for it. I'm afraid Terri has a habit of bad behavior, like calling teachers jerks during a board meeting. You don't have to take my word for it, it is on the official podcast. The very next podcast starts with Terri claiming that she never said it and that it was only a rumor, despite the existence of audio to the contrary. Everything I have said is backed by audio recordings, you don't have to take my word for it.

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If it has colored my opinions

If it has colored my opinions (and again, I am not the kind of person that lets friends color my political opinions and choices), it has done so only because I know that Terri is not the wicked harpy that Todd's campaign is making her out to be.
She's been accused of a lot of things that I know are not true, like using her position to help "developer friends" and deliberately hiding money.

My family is involved in real estate development around the county. My parents and aunts and uncles (on both my mother's and father's sides) went to high school with her. Our families have been very close friends since then; we've vacationed together and my cousins and I were practically raised with her children. When my uncle requested redistricting for neighborhoods on Redwine Road, he was denied because Terri didn't think it was in the best interest of the school system. We have never received any favors or special treatment from the school board and know better than to expect that from Terri. She has a verifiable record of refusing to help her "developer friends"- ask Mike Daughtry or Bob Rolader.

She was not aware she was listed at Action; her name was on the paperwork because the deaths of family members who occupied those positions left them needing to be nominally filled on paper. Since it is her husband's company, her name was the easiest choice (unbeknownst to her). She has never used her position for personal gain and no dishonest "shuffling" of funds took place- she fixed the paperwork error as soon as it was brought to her attention.

Terri is an honest woman, and is on the school board because she has an interest in the welfare of the county's children. I have listened to the audio, and I believe Terri said that people who would not take a pay cut to preserve their co-worker's jobs were "jerks"- not teachers specifically.

Again, Bob Todd is the one basing his campaign around maligning others. Terri is not up for re-election; Todd is slinging mud at her to distance himself from decisions he is documented as having made.

Sorry for the tangent, but I feel that clearing up some of Todd's accusations (and the accusations of people on these forums) could shed some light on his unsavory tactics.

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Terri Smith's Paperwork Mixup

I'm sorry, she had to sign a notarized document to be placed in that position. Are you seriously telling me that Terri Smith, the chairman of the BOE, managed to sign and have notarized a document without being aware of its contents? It wasn't just a random paper put in front of her, it was notarized! Either she's lying or she's terribly irresponsible with her personal finances, and neither of those options are good. As far as the "jerks" comment, she was talking about Fayette teachers. They were the ones being encouraged to take the pay cut, she was talking about them. She also denied it. She got caught saying something she shouldn't have and when called out, she lied instead of doing the honorable thing and apologize. I understand that she's your friend and think she is nice. Most people are nice to their friends. Unfortunately, people I know have been on the receiving end of some decidedly ugly behavior from Terri Smith. As a result I don't think she's a nice person, and there are audio recordings to prove it.

AnnieCowan
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It was a chaotic time- some

It was a chaotic time- some family members passed away and a lot of changes had to be made in the company. Lots of papers were signed and notarized; I can imagine it would be easy to forget that you fill a nominal position with all that going on.
Not that I'm excusing it-- it was clearly a big mistake that shouldn't have been made. However, the only thing "shuffled" was quite a bit of paperwork.

The statement I heard was Terri saying that teachers who would not take a pay cut to preserve their fellow teachers' jobs were "jerks". A poor choice of words, maybe, but certainly not a condemnation of all teachers.

However, all this is irrelevant considering she's not up for re-election. I'll be happy to have this conversation when that time comes but for now I'd like to stick to the issues at hand.

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Then Why Didn't She Apologize?

If what simply a poor choice of words, why didn't she simply apologize? Those teacher jobs were at risk because of her own poor decision making. Other school systems did not overspend, and had reserve funds while we did not, and plenty of the blame falls on Terri Smith. I don't believe it is wise to call the people you are asking to make serious financial sacrifices, because of your own incompetence, "jerks" if they have concerns. Teachers were not just worried about the cuts they were taking then, they were concerned they would never get any of that money back. They were already seriously underpaid before the cuts. Teachers don't choose to teach in this county because the pay and benefits are good. They were being pressured to vote to take pay cuts, and being told explicitly by the chairman of the BOE that they would be jerks to vote no. There is no excuse for her words, or her later denials. It showed extremely poor character, and it absolutely is important to this election. If Charlie Cave loses this election, Terri Smith will no longer be board chairman. I think that is something people need to consider when they vote in the coming election. As for the excuses for why Terri Smith failed to report $12 mill: "it was a chaotic time" wouldn't fly with the IRS or any court of law and it certainly doesn't fly with me. I consider it a serious ethics violation and I hope they look further into it. That is a perfect example of an actual ethics complaint, as opposed to the empty threat made against Dr. Todd by Janet Smola and Terri Smith. I would call that an "unsavory" tactic by those two, but I suspect you wouldn't.

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Todd blames everyone but himself...

Look, I have already said what I intended to say; I'm not excusing the mistakes, just providing a bit of background in case you felt like knowing the circumstances surrounding and leading up to these events. You are entitled to your opinions and I'm pretty sure I'm not going to change them for you.
Please keep in mind that it was a response to a hypothetical situation and her words were later twisted. Terri used to be a teacher; I'm sure she doesn't like their pay cut or the furlough days any more than the rest of us do and I know she does not think teachers are "jerks". She's not a monster, she's a former teacher and a mother who wants to make sure that her children and yours receive the best education they can. That is why she's on the school board. That is all I am going to say about this.
Terri is not an issue in this election; it is Bob Todd we should be discussing. If you think Terri is responsible for the current state of the BOE's finances, then Bob Todd is equally to blame, considering he served on the same board and frequently voted with her. He's trying to wash his hands of the mistakes the board collectively made by pointing fingers at the other members. THAT is an unsavory campaigning tactic; he should be playing up his strengths, not dragging everyone else through the mud to make himself look better in comparison.

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Terri Smith/ Janet Smola's Unsavory Tactics

You keep talking about "unsavory" tactics from Dr. Todd, yet have not managed to name one except "mudslinging" which is not even close to an accurate description of Dr. Todd's interview which was a fairly evenhanded, mild criticism of the current board. Criticizing the board, especially with ample evidence, isn't mudslinging. Mudslinging is lying about your fellow board member's position on an issue and having a friend spam an email list with that lie. That's something Janet Smola is guilty of, not Dr. Todd. You refuse to acknowledge the shameful and downright embarrassing behavior Terri Smith and Janet Smola exhibited at the following meetings, or their transparent attempt to sling mud by threatening to file an ethics complaint, which they clearly never intended to do. I was embarrassed for them after that display. They are grown women who should know better than to make such fools of themselves in public. I don't understand your repeated defense of Smith's ugly "jerks" comment, which was not twisted or taken out of context. They were in the middle of discussing whether or not to ask teachers if they were willing to take a pay cut, and she said only a jerk would refuse to take the cut. She's the board chairman. What do you think teachers felt when they heard that the BOE wanted their opinion, but the chairman thought they'd have to be jerks to say no? That's not really putting the question to them neutrally, is it? It doesn't really make them think that the BOE actually cares about them or what they want, does it? Her words have power based on her position as board chairman. You must be able to understand that. I think this incident is an perfect example of her leadership and integrity. If she had admitted her mistake and directly apologized to the teachers of this county, I wouldn't bring it up, but she didn't. Her status as board chairman will be determined by this election, so she really is relevant to the discussion at hand.

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you ...KNOW? ANNIE COWAN?? REALLY?

YOU post that everyone else is spreading rumors...what is your inside knowlege? I'm all ears...you seem to think yourself the knowlege based Moses come down from the Smolite/Smith hill..

Please give us details of how you know this to be true?

I'm amazed that everyone else is getting sucked in...you don't like people that don't print their name and tell stories(or so you say) back it up with FACTS!

If you don't...you are much much worse than the people that are afraid of the things the strong armed 3/2 will do. THEY HAVE VALID REASONS for not telling their name...these people (3 amigos) are not nice people.

If you know the truth and are so above board ( I don't think so) please do tell us the truth...we are waiting.

You have nothing to be afraid of...you have chastied others...and implied yourself Polly Pure Heart...of a group of people that appear highly unethical if not worse.

I'm just dying to hear your inside knowlege...back it up ...or you are just as bad as Smola telling lies in publice office...Smith/ a devolpers wife that can't remember 12.5 million...by the way...others are checking, there seemed to be more mooney..

but do not play goodie two schools..

AND PLEASE DON'T SMEAR...AND YES..I SAID SMEAR...DR TODD... IF YOU CAN'T BACK IT UP ...DON'T SAY IT..!

AnnieCowan
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Obviously my "inside

Obviously my "inside knowledge" comes from being a friend of Smith's...?

I'm not going to post details of her personal life on the Internet, if that's what you're fishing for. I recognize that my opinion of her politically may be affected by knowing her personally, but I am willing to put my name and reputation on the line to vouch for her being a decent person.

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you...

suggarfoot
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Your name? your reputation?

what do you do with that dog?

AnnieCowan
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Out of Line

Excuse me??? That's wildly inappropriate.

Clearly you did not read my earlier post-- that whole *civil* conversation started because I said I was a friend of Terri's.

I'm not really sure what you're even talking about, but that comment was way out of line. I'm not going to acknowledge you anymore and I'm sure nobody else takes you seriously.

suggarfoot
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Do you teach in Fulton county?

or are they wrong?

suggarfoot
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It all started cause you are a friend of Terries?

Really will you explain more? why should we not ask...about your dogs and your dealings with Terri Smith? what is wrong with that? Either your mind is in the gutter, or you are really sick.

suggarfoot
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Your name? your reputation?

what do you do with that dog?

suggarfoot
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you just didi! Oh pleaseeee

"I'm not sure what yo want me to tell you" OMG

Why are you guys talking to this?

Courthouserules
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AnnieC

Man, I started to pass on commenting on this one but I feel that I must tell you that it gave me chills and I worry about you getting into deeper trouble.
This Todd fellow may be "unsavory" as you say, I don't know. I never heard such before the election came up. Someone not knowing about millions of dollars on an official report either is sloppy, has a terrible lawyer or is dishonest----surely her husband read it? Enough said there.
There are many shenanigans done and tolerated throwing real estate around in this whole country. You will know someday where it all came from.
I also have had close friends whom I cohorted with over the years, but that has little to do with business!
We are in a "recession+ and it reminds me of the "Great Depression," of the 30s, where unscrupulous bankers, etc., robbed all of the land for non-payment of taxes! Much of PTCs "old money" came from there!
Did you mean to say that Terri said teacher's were "jerks," other workers were jerks, both were "jerks," or neither?
Best to be general if possible.

AnnieCowan
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Don't put words into my mouth

I said Todd's *tactics* were unsavory... I don't know the man so I won't comment on him personally. Please don't put words into my mouth or twist what I've said; I'm trying to be nice here.

It sounds like you are confirming my statement about Terri not giving my family special treatment-- just because she has friends who happen to be developers does not mean she is using her position to help them.

wildcat
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AnnieCowan-We're still waiting....

....to hear about the unsavory tactics. And remember, please be specific. Thank you.

suggarfoot
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you little witch

Dr Todd and his family are some of the most respected people in this county, if not this state!

These people are a legacy that Fayette county is proud of

You on the other hand tout...1. a woman that just can't logicly remember unless she is Methuselah...

Normal people have family members die. things are in place...and they don't forget, 12.5 million...my family has a large co..I grant you...when I sign..the lawyer always explains it to me...

I'm no different than anyone else...explain to me why her memory should be no less accountable?

When people sign 'those papers' it makes them accountable for the welfare of the employees of that co..

Which way is it...she doesn't take the employees seriously...or her word to Fayette county seriously...it is one of the other big girl

oh I know...you just don't want to say..

Courthouserules
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Unsavory

I don't think someone can use unsavory tactics and them not be unsavory!
Might you have meant sneaky, devious, sly, etc.? But that would apply to Wall Street people, some lawyers, developers, landflippers, many bankers, and others.
People don't generally run for a seat on a local board to do things like "do what is best" for the kids or population.
They like the recognition, maybe the power, or other such reasons.
It is impossible to do what is best for all kids----they are not alike.

AnnieCowan
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I do believe a person can be

I do believe a person can be caught up in unsavory campaign tactics but still be a good person. Again, don't put words in my mouth. Obviously, Bob Todd has an interest in maintaining Fayette County schools' standard of excellence; that is admirable. I don't necessarily think all his ideas are good ones, and I certainly don't like the mudslinging campaign he is running. But I will stop short of calling Bob Todd unsavory, sneaky, devious, sly, or any other such words because I respect his dedication to the school system.

Clearly, judging by everyone's comments, being a school board member is a thankless job at which no one can do anything but wrong, and I admire any person willing to put themselves through that.

wildcat
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Annie---do tell....

....what unsavory tactics? Please be detail-oriented with your response (include dates, locations, links to podcasts, quotes, etc.)

Suzie
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What Tactics?

What "unsavory" tactics? Honestly, I'm wondering. Exactly what has he done that falls in the "unsavory" category. Publicly admitting he and the board were wrong and he'd like to see changes made are not "unsavory" tactics. At least he made those comments openly instead of asking others to do his dirty work for him, unlike Smith and Smola. Lying to voters through email about what your fellow board member said could fall under the "unsavory" category, but that was Smola and not Todd. Calling your friends and asking them to denigrate a board member at a board meeting is fairly "unsavory," but that was Smith, not Todd. Please outline these "unsavory" actions by Todd.

grassroots
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Dr. Todd Was Lied To About Voting For Unnecessary Schools.

They're lying to us about cost per student. They don't count the bond payments, the building costs and the SPLOST money. There are also other items in the cloak of the hidden budget they don't reveal. It's done nation wide. See "They Spend What?" http://www.splostpoll.com/2010/03/they-spend-what.html
It's really closer to $12K-$13K per student.
Also he had just come back to his post when they said he was told (by the SS) that the bond had "mandated" the money be spent on the unnecessary schools.
See his interview and real story at www.splostpoll.com
Next to the recent financial scandals, the education system in America has the 2nd highest rate of investigation into corruption of shuffling money.
Sorry Mr.Sullivan, Todd is leading in the polls with 80%.
ps. Mr. Sullivan, I still have your email that stated if I voted for E_SPLOST my property taxes would go down and some bonds would be paid off. I didn't fall for it and I'm still waiting for those to come to pass.

Just Asking
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Where is the context of Dr. Todd's comments?

Words taken out of context can be interpreted in sometimes unintended ways, apparently this is what has happended with Mr. Sullivan's interpretation of Dr. Todd's comments. When an organization is in dire circumstances, less than desirable sometimes have to be discussed though they are not ideal. Mr. Sullivan's comments make it sound like Dr. Todd doesn't support foundational programs which I doubt is true.

Suzie
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Citizen Biased? Ha!

I am an anonymous poster, and of course you have to decide for yourself if what I say is credible. That's entirely up to you. Nothing I have said has been proven to be false. As far as bias against Charlie Cave, please point to any article that shows bias against him. He chose not to communicate with them and they were obligated to inform their readership so they cannot be accused of ignoring or excluding him. There has been very little written about him in this paper, and he has only himself to blame.

AnnieCowan
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Nothing you've said has been

Nothing you've said has been proven true, either. The burden of proof typically lies with the accuser in situations like this.

I'm referring to a bias in general, not specifically in Charlie Cave's case since, you are right, he hasn't put himself in a position for that to happen. Beverly is pretty fond of endorsing or belittling candidates in those "opinion" pieces, which I think is a bit low given that he is the editor.
Besides, the 'reporters' have a bad habit of getting key details wrong or just plain twisting them.
I don't trust anything that's written in The Citizen and most other people in town take it with a grain of salt, too.

Suzie
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Nothing You Say Has Been Proven True

You haven't exactly offered any proof either for these accusations have you? I also live here and know many people who trust The Citizen more than other so-called newspapers. I really wish you would offer something substantive to the conversation instead of just pointing out that anonymous posters don't always have the facts. Any adult can figure out for themselves that you should not automatically believe everything you read, you have to rely on your own judgment.

AnnieCowan
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You mean the accusations

You mean the accusations about the Citizen? Look up any of the opinion pieces about local elections (I'm thinking of one about DA Ballard but there are more).

A few months ago, someone I knew passed away suddenly of natural causes at his parents' home. John Munford wrote an article about it. He got their address wrong and therefore the house he looked up in the records was in someone else's name, so he stated that he was found "on the property" of his neighbors. In reality, it was in a guest house at his parents' home. There was mention of a "pending toxicology report" and Munford wrote that his parents used to live in the neighborhood, but it was unclear if they still maintained a residence in the area.

Munford's article was worded to imply that he had gotten drunk/overdosed on something, staggered into a stranger's yard, and died. It was false, offensive, and incredibly insensitive. The family was naturally upset by it and never received an apology. I'd link to the article but it was taken down after readers who knew him complained.

That is exactly the kind of shoddy reporting I have come to expect from The Citizen's staff.

And yes, any adult knows that you shouldn't believe everything anonymous posters say. However, jumping to the kind of conclusions you are about Cave "faking" food poisoning is pretty unfair and publicly stating that sort of thing could damage his chances at a fair election. If you think he's unfit for the position, that's fine, and you do certainly have a point that he doesn't answer questions publicly. I'm not disputing that. I just take an issue with unproven conclusions being masqueraded as fact.

Suzie
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Opinions are opinions

Opinion pieces are exactly that, opinions. That is the purpose they serve in any newspaper. As for your story about bad reporting: like you, I can't say if what you said is true or not. I do know that I haven't seen any inaccuracies in the reporting about the school board elections. I also highly doubt that my posts here are going to keep the coming elections from being fair. Frankly, I find that idea absolutely laughable. Considering we have Janet Smola instructing people like David Warner to send out false, alarmist emails about Bob Todd, the idea that my scant posts on this website are going too far is seemingly deliberately obtuse.

Here's the Smola/Warner Email story, just so you know it isn't a "conclusion being masqueraded as fact":
http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/07-06-2010/gop-race-school-board-anti...
Of course, you're welcome to disbelieve it all you want as it was exposed by this newspaper.

AnnieCowan
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I'm familiar with that story,

I'm familiar with that story, and the lawyer's name is Doug. It looks like the story was actually exposed by a private citizen named Hinchey and simply reported here.

My issue is with Beverly not maintaining the neutrality that I think is becoming of an editor. Of course he is entitled to use the paper as a soapbox for his own ideals, but in a perfect world he might have some journalistic integrity and refrain.

Again, I am not accusing The Citizen of false reporting on the school board election issue- I am discussing the 'artistic license' that seems to apply to the writing staff in general. That is why I don't put a lot of stock in things reported by this paper.

AnnieCowan
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Oops, double posted!

Sorry!

Suzie
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Charlie Cave's "Illness"

Here's what I know about Cave and that forum. Before the event, he kept putting off the organizers when they tried to set a date; he actually wanted the questions in advance; when he was first approached to take part in the event he refused; two hours before it was to start he sent an email claiming food poisoning from an earlier engagement (where no one else appears to have gotten sick). Tell me, when a child doesn't do his homework before a test, tries to convince the teacher to delay the test, tries to get the test questions in advance, and then suddenly becomes ill the day of the test, do you believe him? I don't. I also have observed his attempts to avoid any discussion about the issues, including: ignoring this paper's requests for communication and wasting his time at the rotary meeting by only talking about his private life.

AnnieCowan
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How can we trust that you're

How can we trust that you're a credible, reliable source of information? You're an anonymous poster and until you say who you are and how you know what you claim to know, not to mention provide some proof other than hearsay, we can't take your word for it. I don't mean any disrespect, of course-- obviously there are records of the rotary meeting, and if you can substantiate the rest of what you say you know, it's a different story entirely.

I don't know Charlie Cave personally, but I do know a lot of other people who have been the only member of their party to have gotten food poisoning... he could have easily ordered a dish no one else ordered. It happens all the time.

And in regards to not communicating with The Citizen... we all know the questions would be slanted against him. Let's not lend journalistic integrity where none's due. I'd love to have a paper with decent circulation that let me decide for myself in town.

Annie Cowan

Courthouserules
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credible, reliable

There are so few credible, reliable sources anymore (I point to Wall Street; Banks, Finance; Most Lawyers; now Many Judges; and other Me, me people) that I need more than such a "source."

me.and_the_sea
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Annie Cowan

Your in luck! There is another paper in Fayette where you can leave comments if you sign your name. Why don't you just run off over there?

You don't like anonymous posters?

We don't like

people who no show forums last minute.

Janet Smola caught in a lie by nothing less than a lawyer, a concerned citizen,Mr Hinchey, and the superintendent of Fayette county schools. Would you call Dr DeCotis a lie too?

We also don't like Neil Sullivan and Janet Smola using our emails to hawk their candidate. The email addresses were given only to be used to convey information about our children. Not Janet Smola's pet project called build your on candidate. She hasn't quite got the voice box perfected yet.

You are so hung up on giving names while the campaign hacks look like Typhoid Mary and friends.

That is ok Honey, we all have our priorities, your more the type if the ship was sinking you would be worried about the paint job chipping.

We would be worried about why it was sinking, pardon us all that we don't introduce ourselves.

AnnieCowan
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I have no issue with

I have no issue with anonymous posters until they present hearsay without qualifying, sourcing, or substantiating it. It's very easy to invent 'facts' and pass them along as truth, especially when you don't have to say how you happen to know what you claim to know.

Other than that, I'm not really sure what you're trying to imply. What's with the paint job on a ship part?

Courthouserules
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anonymous forum

I simply can't imagine, after careful thought, just how most everything written in these comments for the last few years would have been here at all if everyone had to sign their name, address, and phone number (and lawyer's name).

It is up to each person reading these comments to double check for facts.
And----I'll just bet you I could mention 30-40 items which would have had little discussion if not on here! (My moniker for instance give you a clue?)

AnnieCowan
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Anonymity

I am not at all saying that everyone should have to identify themselves-- what I am saying is that if someone is going to offer "evidence" that hinges on their personal word (i.e. "I personally know that Charlie Cave asked to back out of the debate"), then they should qualify that by not posting it entirely anonymously, whether it's "I'm a parent that was at the meeting" or "My name is Jane Doe and I have a bug on Charlie Cave's phone". All I'm saying is that you can't rely on an anonymous poster's personal guarantee, especially if they offer no clue as to how they came by the information they're presenting.

Courthouserules
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offer evidence?

She said she personally knew! Not going to give you the name!
You simply can't believe everything you read on here. Public people who give their names get a lot of static----especially people running for office. Do YOU personally know that he asked to back out? Were you on a wiretap or something?
See what I mean?
Hey, he wasn't there---he doesn't have to be.

Suzie
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Charlie Cave's No show

It was reported in this paper that he backed out, via email, about 2hrs before it was scheduled to begin. He actually suggested they postpone it, knowing full well that was impossible and that people were already setting up the room. The other details came from people who organized the event, but no one has to believe me and I am certainly not giving out the names of the people I know that gave me this information. I'm also not the only poster here who has mentions these things. Some of the things posted here by anonymous posters have been proven to be true. In fact, Neil Sullivan was caught in a lie in the comments on this article. He claimed he never promoted Charlie Cave in his emails, which was proven untrue by an anonymous poster who received one of the emails.

AtHomeGym
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Paint Job

Why don't you just take it like "rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic" sort of comment?

AnnieCowan
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That's kind of what I thought

That's kind of what I thought he/she was going for, but who knows?

I would have to point out that the Fayette County School System is doing pretty well, particularly given the state of the economy-- if that's what was meant by the ship, I wouldn't describe it as sinking at all.

Courthouserules
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Annie

Deck Chairs and paint chips comments mean that he thinks you think "little" unimportant things and probably don't understand what is critical!
Getting on a life boat is critical----not paint chips.
Rearranging deck chairs just to sink to the bottom of the sea is ridiculous!
There are people who have such thoughts, and mostly women for some neatness reason, but I doubt you do.
I say that because the dog looks vicious!

AnnieCowan
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I've heard the deck chairs on

I've heard the deck chairs on the Titanic one before; I'd never heard about the paint chips and I was wondering if it meant something different. I guess it doesn't?

The dog is actually very nice-- vicious dogs never, ever wear bandannas.

Suzie
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Fayette County School System is not doing well

I'm sorry, but please look at the numbers on the FCBOE website. Fayette schools are not doing well financially due to poor accounting by the comptroller and overbuilding by the BOE. The financial crisis we were in last year was not a result of the bad economy, it was a result of clear incompetence and you only have to look at the numbers yourself to see that. The board voted to cut teacher pay and give them furlough days in Jan/Feb 09 because they were expecting the budget to put them in the red, and then the comptroller managed to find more money (several million dollars)that she somehow had previously overlooked the very next month. They were making financial decisions based on bad accounting that hurt employees. It's public record and it is your duty to familiarize yourself with it. It's your right to dismiss anything we say in these comments, but you are doing yourself a disservice not to look at the facts that are easily accessible and on the public record.

AnnieCowan
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I've looked at the facts,

I've looked at the facts, thank you very much. Yes, there are financial problems-- everyone has them these days-- but it's a far cry from the Titanic, especially when you look at other systems in the state.
The facts are that the 09-10 budget yielded a very large balance. I believe Fayette was one of 3 counties to have built a balance. Academically, we have one of the best school systems in the nation and that doesn't seem to be changing any time soon if we keep heading in the right direction.

You're correct, though- they did make financial decisions based on bad accounting. That's not the board members' fault, it's the accountant's. And as for the overbuilding, Todd voted for that, too; how will re-electing him stop it?

Veritas
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Checked Facts REALLY

Did you know that in one year Fayette County high Schools have dropped from 6 to 20 slots on the GHSGT in One year. All you have to do is go to the GADOE web.

Betcha didn't know Mcintosh used to be Number 1 in Ga.
Do a little more research and some real interesting facts will come about.. like who was the Secondary Curriculum director in Fayette County at the time when Fayette was Really at the top of the charts..

Veritas
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deleted by poster

deleted by poster

g8trgrl
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Close BMMS = money savings

The FCBOE voted to build Rivers because the bean counters at the BoE office told them the capacity was needed. The Board members get their info from the county employees and have to hope those people know what they're doing when predicting how many kids are coming to the county.

I have an idea to save this county some big bucks - close Bennett's Mill Middle School! How many kids do they have there? 500? What a waste of money it is to run that school. Full time pay to all that staff! Air conditioning and heating a big building for how many kids? Those kids could easily be at other middle schools. The kids in the north PTC area would probably love to go back to Booth Middle School & get to ride the golf carts in instead of a 12 mile bus ride! The area around BMMS will take forever to build out. While the county is waiting, save the money & close the school!

grassroots
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Good comment g8 girl. Now connect the dots

That's where the WFB begins/ Cleveland Elemntary is also only at around 60-70% capacity. Now they want to build a 6th high school across the 54 next to the WFB! BOE, commissioners, developers and money. As Slim Pickens used to say" They're All In Cahoots."

Suzie
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Neil Sullivan Has No Shame

He has the gall to send out emails that suggest that this newspaper is not giving his candidate (Give up the ghost, Neil, this is a small community and people talk; we know you're working with Smola) a fair shake, even though this paper has printed two of his distorted fact filled anti-Todd letters. Get real, Neil. Cave has purposely ignored Ben Nelms' questions, just like he ignored that forum. Where, I happen to know, he wanted to have all the questions in advance, because he knew he needed Janet and Terri to come up with the answers for him. This request was rejected, because it was meant to be a chance for voters to question the candidates directly, something Cave has avoided doing throughout the campaign. That's why he backed out at the last minute like a coward. What is this paper supposed to do when the candidate won't communicate with them, Neil? It isn't bias to tell voters than Cave will not answer questions, it is fact.

NeilSullivan
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Suzi ask Charlie

That was the point of the Email! He was at the Rotary as was I, as was Ben.

I am unhappy with Dr. Todd's comments both inthe AJC voter guide and teh Michael Meyer interview. That's my right as a voter. At least someone is presenting an other take on things.

I am unhappy that Charlie hasn't been out there and has not been more active in advocating himself.

By knowing our options we make good decisons. How hard is this?

If I were campaigning for Charlie, there would be a meet and greet at my house ( hasn't happened ). An explicit endorsement ( hasn't happened ) A presentation of Cave talking points (nope).

Veritas
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If I were campaigning for Charlie,

Once again are you that intellectually challenged or ??? Your name is on the letter with Charlie Caves sign attached.. and political material in the email being blasted around

"If I hear of any meet and greets or other events where you can meet Charlie, I will be sure to pass along. He is using a very small town approach of personal meetings which is less visible to most people."
??

Suzie
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Cave Won't Answer Questions in Public

Charlie Cave wasted his allotted time to speak at the Rotary meeting, choosing to talk about his personal life instead of the issues. His answers were hesitant and unsatisfactory one on one as well. He has refused to take questions from the public, going so far to fake an illness to get out of the candidate's forum. That was an event that many people worked to put together, and he selfishly attempted to ruin it because he can't answer questions himself. If he only answers questions through email, it's because he has to forward them to Janet and Terri so they can give him the answers. He is also clearly afraid to have any direct opinions on the public record. These are not the actions of a man who has looked at the problems facing our district and tried to find solutions. I find your equivocating on whether or not Janet Smola could be considered your friend and whether or not you're campaigning for Cave completely pathetic.

PS. Someone actually tried to reset my password early this morning. To whoever did it: Don't waste your time, you would have to hack into my email to reset it.

AnnieCowan
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Suzie's Accusation

Suzie:
I really think you should provide proof that Cave "faked" food poisoning to "selfishly ruin" the meeting before you sling out accusations like that. Was he seen out in public when he should have been at home sick, or did you just decide that's what happened because it bolsters your argument? About half of your argument seems to be based on things you have simply decided are true with no proof whatsoever.

Veritas
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Password reset

Same thing happened to me yesterday??
Curious

me.and_the_sea
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Mr Charles Cave

I think you would come forward and say something. The statement by Janet Smola that Dr Todd said he would redistrict has been proven an outright lie by Dr DeCotis. This statement was made in an attempt to get you elected. Do you understand how bad it looks?

The hijacking of emails of parent's of Fayette county children for the purpose of promoting you has upset many people. Do you understand by saying nothing people can only assume you are responsible for these tactics?

Quite honestly I've never seen such outright disregard for truth or ethics.

Do you have anything to say on any topic Mr Cave?

me.and_the_sea
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Mr Sullivan false info on your emails

Are you aware there are many retired Delta people in this town that knew Mr Cave? As one man just put it. To put Charlies name and planning analyst in the same sentence is not only a falsehood, it is downright cruel! Why don't you tell the folks what he really did?

Brooks Parent
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emails are full of distortions

Is everyone receiving emails from this Neil character full of of out of context quotes from Dr. Todd? I had one forwarded to me. What crap!!!
We as a community are going to have to make some hard decisions. The money is not going to be there to continue the level of funding that occurs at the local level. There is also discussion at the capital that funding to the local districts is going to be cut again in the fall. hummm...how do we plan for that...rely on Cave's wealth of experience? I don't think so!

suggarfoot
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uneducated Charlie Cave

Brooks parent, you are right. We need someone that has the background, experience, and INTELLIGENCE.

We already have

1.a blow hard, (for profit only) so called charity? organizer. A would be if could be social climber.

2. a developer's wife (who forgets 12.5 MILLION DOLLARS! You know how it is when you have so much)

Those two would love to have someone with no more intelligence than them! They looked long n hard for someone like that.

People, they are insulting. Something is wrong when the candidate won't answer questions in public! Neil Sullivan and the rest of the Smolites want you to EMAIL your questions to him? Doesn't that strike you the least bit odd?

What could he possibly do when asked a question at the BOE? hide under the table till Janet and Alice in wonderland answer for him?

Come on people.

Veritas
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OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH! NEIL

NEIL, Neil,Neil, mmm, mmm, mmm!,
Just opened my inbox and as a FCBOE parent what do I find, a political e-mail promoting one Charlie Cave. Now I will let you know sir you and your cohorts are treading on very thin ice. My email address was not given to the school to receive unsolicited political e-mails. Now let’s get into the legal ramifications your, yourself have just entered. I just got off the phone with friends who receive the same e-mail via a PTO e-mail list. Tsk, tsk, tsk this can cause them to lose their non-profit status. Neil facts?? Ethicality (LMAO) are you that dumb or just another liar!

Why must Charlie hold small private meetings? HMMMM
Must have you campaign for him? HMMMM
Can’t make public forums after non-profit meeting with Mrs. Smola? HMMMM

Makes you go HMMMM!

Please tell me how you got My name and who authorized or gave this to you!!

I eagerly await your reply!

NeilSullivan
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OOOOOOH Veritas

If you got an email from me we corresponded at one point. That email was sent to 61 people as a favor. If you are on that list, you also recieved the CRCT data and did not protest. Ask off at anytime.

I would ask Mr. Cave your questions in the forums provided. The email is from the AJC voter guide.

Given your Coweta school question, I think I know who you are, email me if you want.

Bedtime.

Veritas
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Neil, Just gotta Say Bless Your Heart

My Dear, Dear Neil Bless your heart.
Once again you show your mastery of supposition and hearsay. It would behoove you to invest in hooked on phonics or enroll in an SRA reading comprehension program. Nowhere did I mention or say that I received an email from YOU. I received your correspondence via forwarding from being on a school e-mail list. So you had better check your facts and talk with your cohorts using PTO email lists, booster club lists etc. in facilitating the disbursement of your political propaganda and as to it’s legal ramifications.

Have a great weekend

me.and_the_sea
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Mr Sullivan

I noticed you keep trying to guess who betrays you. Sir, many people are getting unwanted emails. Those emails were given in regards to school matters. You are using them in a rather shady attempt to further your candidate.

I did a little research on the supposed qualifications on my own unwanted email. One of the qualifications you list is Board of directors for United Way. Very few people give to United Way anymore because of the stories of bloated salaries for fundraisers. People like to think all their money is going to charity.

Anyway, I found Board of directors a stretch. I did find a little two page thing on a local Fayette county united way that Janet Smola is cooking up. I noticed it gave him as an advisor along with a string of other people, including photos by Rene Ellis. She is the Human Resource person we imported from Dekalb county. Someone said she had only taught three years in Dekalb before the promotion.

I'm sorry, I really don't like this sort of underhanded dealings.

wildcat
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No use for United Way

The United Way is heavily promoted through the school system. In fact, some schools even ask for a building rep to handle the paperwork (volunteer, of course).

I (stupidly) used to donate every year with my money designated to go the Flint River Boy Scout Council. Well, guess what? I found out that my money does not always go there. I was informed that the UW will give the money to whomever they please and may, or may not, give any of it to the designated organization. The Boy Scout contact I spoke to also told me that it is best to donate directly to whatever organization it is that you want your money to go. I write them a check every year instead of going through the UW. I think of all the years I did that and had no clue and wonder where my money went.

I have no use for the UW or anyone affiliated with that organization. I don't like being lied to.

suggarfoot
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Neill Sullivan you are so low

"I would ask Mr. Cave you questions in the forums provided." That is a laugh! He doesn't attend forums where he has to talk about issues!

What is your forum you speak of...oh I know ..."EMAIL US YOUR QUESTIONS..We'll get you an answer as soon as Janet makes one up".

suggarfoot
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Neil old boy ...I'm still waiting for answers

from last week.

Your letters are like from someone in a trace!

NeilSullivan
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Suggar you get a point

Sorry for the delay busy busy busy.

Anyway I am going to use bullets becasue time is short.

1. I focus only on my issues. There is no reason to answer Mrs. Onesi especially since I do not see her blogging in her own name.

2. You are correct There are a net 7 schools added since 2004. That is why I normally use one or more QC people. I added that last minute because I thought it was interesting and went to fast. No matter it is my fault my appologies to you.

3. As you can see the difference in capacity numbers is State approved maximum versus Fayette target max (about 6 points). I do think we need to consider system capacity as an overall measure then its components. I have sent Cal that model 2003 - 2010. You are welcome to it just email me.

Bear in mind that systems such as Clayton, Dekalb and Atlanta Public subscribe to state maximums. I personally think smaller is better but I have a first grader, how about you? Oh PTC Elm 90 +%.

That is the best part of all of this, when I got into the school game, years ago, it was over Centennial Elm. If they were going to build an unnecessary school, I would have preferred that one. BUT not building Centennial is and was the right decision.

4. You raise the right points about schools like Huddleston and Burch. I do not agree with the governement taking land to build anything though.

5. We can only deal with the incumbents we have in front of us. We can deal with the others in two years. I may surprise you.

End of the day I am a neighbor like you joining the debate where I can. But remember I am not a candidate nor do I represent one. I try to bring facts and analysis and if I am wrong I say it as above.

Take Care,

Neil

suggarfoot
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"End OF DAY I'M NOT A CANDIATE..NOR DO I REPRESENT ONE!

"End of the day I am a neighbor like you joining the debate where I can. But remember I am not a candidate nor do I represent one. I try to bring facts and analysis and if I am wrong I say it as above.

Take Care

NEIL

YOUR BUZZARDS ARE COMMING HOME TO ROOST!!!

I LOVE YOUR LITTE PDF FILE ATTACHMENT WHICH SAYS..

"Hi Everybody:

I have been asked to pass along some information about Charlie Cave. He was a member of the Fayette Citizens for Children during the E-SPLOST even standing in the pouring rain to hand out flyers at the FCHS v. WWHS game that year.

Get the FACTS.

You may contact Charlie yourself at CharlieCave4boe@gmail.com.

Also, he is distributing information through Facebook. Please friend Charlie Cave and you can find out more about him.

If I hear of any meet and greets or other events where you can meet Charlie, I will be sure to pass along. He is using a very small town approach of personal meetings which is less visible to most people.

Also you can check out the AJC voter guide at http://tinyurl.com/2fnso3t

Making an informed decision about the future of our schools is important, please pass this along to anyone you deem appropriate. Charlie may not be running the campaign that The Citizen wants him to run, but we should know our options before voting on TUESDAY JULY 20.

Neil"

love and kisses...Neil....you guys are so disgusting..

now come on...tell us you didn't write this? We have more...lots more..

Now let's get to it..

WHY ARE YOU PROMOTING AND UNEDUCATED MAN FOR THIS POSITION...?

INQURING MINDS WANT TO KNOW!

WHY ARE YOU POSTING LIES...LIES...AND MORE LIES IN THE PAPER?

HONEY...I'M NOT THROUH WITH YOU...YOU KNOW WHAT...I EASY HAVE OVER 1000 EMAIL ADDRESS...THAT CAME OFF YOUR TREES...

DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT I'M GOING TO DO WITH THEM?

(I'LL GIVE YOU A HINT...EITHER I'M GONNA SENT THEM THE TRUTH..HMMM...

OR...

I'M GONNA TURN THEM OVER TO THE ETHICS PEOPLE...I DID SAY THERE WERE MORE FROM OTHERS...DIDN'T I?)

But why? what is wrong with you? What is in this for you? Why ruin yourself like this? Can you explain any of this?

Do you really think if you play 'little bo peep' in the blogs our attention is not on the hoards of emails?

YOU GUYS ARE LIKE THE GANG THAT COULDN'T SHOOT STRAIGHT...YOU KEEP FALLING ALL OVER YOURSELVES WITH YOUR STUPIDITY!

LET ME SAY IT REAL SLOW...SO YOU DON'T MISS ANYTHING...

THERE ARE SEVERAL...THAT MEANS MORE THAN ONE...ON EACH OF THESE UNWANTED EMAILS...THAT FORWARD THEM TO ME, OR FRIENDS. THEY ARE NICE PEOPLE THAT RESENT THE INTRUSION.

(INSTUSION...MEANING... THE ACT OF ENTERING WITHOUT WARRANT..UNINVITED...ENCROACHMENT...)

HOW DARE YOU!

suggarfoot
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NEILL SULIVAN...I HAVE THE FACTS!

Dr Todd.

A very nice well respected man is running for re election.

FACTS!

HE HAS OVER 40 YEARS IN EDUCATION. He has devoted his life to our children and education.

WE are beyond lucky to have someone with his background.

His education is awesome and his character is above reproach.

This gentleman has a masters, a double masters.
He was a principle
One of the 1st counselors in the state of Georgia!

State President of Administrators for Exceptional Children

State President of Directors of Curriculum and Instruction

State Vice President of Georgia School Counselors!

State Awards...

Distinguished service for exceptional children

Distinguished service for curriculum and instruction

He has given his life to the betterment of our children!

And you want to degrade him?

And your candidate is who? (more importantly why?)

Charlie Cave!

He graduated from high school.......

and what else? there is a big silence..

I know...he takes orders well..from who?

It is insulting that you push such when there are children involved..our children..!

SHAME ON YOU GUYS!

Suzie
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Neil Sullivan = Smola Stooge

I think it's unethical for you to continue sending these letters, which are undoubtedly copy/pasted from emails from Janet Smola, without disclosing your ties to Smola. I also wonder how you can continue to send out alarmist emails to members of this community, when a similar Smola ruse was exposed by this very newspaper just days ago. Why don't you encourage Smola to speak for herself instead of using you and Doug Warner to do her dirty work. You're embarrassing yourself.

NeilSullivan
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I am what I am

Hi Suzie:

No Janet Smola doesn’t write for me nor do I know Doug Warner. Since I live in Post 1, she is my representation (for now) and is one of the few in government who answer email. She can tell you I am no fan of River’s and am opposed to even 40 students in it.

I am a concerned parent and spouse of a teacher who is trying to find the logic in Dr. Todd’s statements. Why talk of excess capacity if you have no plans to do anything? Why talk about reducing vital elementary school programs if you plan on nothing? Why spend so much letter time in writing about the past and no time about the future? Why say the teacher and a room is all you need and everything else is ancillary, if you believe in the process we have in place? When say you will study when you have been in office 4 years? This is all in the AJC voter guide at http://tinyurl.com/2fnso3t

In a recent Leadership podcast, Rev. Andy Stanley quoted someone I cannot remember saying “when your memories exceed your dreams….. the end is near”. As we continue to squabble about 5 and 3 years ago without really discussing in detail how we go forward, those words ring in my ears.

If you talk to Dr. Todd, you will find that I did make the extra step of trying to ask these questions man to man at the Rotary meeting in a private setting to allow for reason and discussion. After one question he decided to talk to someone else and here we are. Before you (or anyone else) go there, I spent the night of the TEA party meeting at Fayette Community Hospital after my family was involved in an auto accident at 54/74. They are both ok.

As far as alarmist emails (bethca didn’t know about those alarming tweets!), I have sent out our CRCT scores versus other counties; the AJC voter guide along with school capacity detailed by school, CRCT, and High School Performance; my concerns I share publically in the paper and urging people to not believe me or anyone else but to get the facts and make their own decisions for people afraid of a difference of opinion that is alarming.

It’s funny that anyone who disagrees is unethical. Especially since Dr. Todd voted against our ethics manual and I do not believe he has even signed it, although I may be wrong.

Take Care,
Neil
@neilsullivan72 on twitter in case you want to tune in

suggarfoot
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NEIL ...YOU LIAR! YOU PATHEDIC LITTLE CREEP!!

'I AM WHAT I AM' ...You sure are!

And you are some really ugly people!!!!

DO YOU KNOW HOW LONG...??? PEOPLE HAVE BEEN COLLECTING YOUR EMAILS?

DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY I'M GOING TO POST IN THE PAPER? AND WHAT DATES? I think you guys need to pack it up! YOU KNOW WHERE THEY CAME FROM? PEOPLE WHO WANT THIS TO STOP!

HOT OFF THE PRESS...

DATE JULY 8, !!!TODAY!!!! 5:20 PM... LESS THAN AN HOUR BEFORE YOUR GARBAGE ON THE CITIZEN!

YOU MUST HAVE SHORT TERM MEMORY!...

YOU DID IT....WE HAVE IT...!

AND HERE IT GOES!!!

EMAIL

SUBJECT

CHARLIE CAVE!!!

Hi Everybody:

I have been asked to pass along some information about Charlie Cave. He was a member of the Fayette Citizens for Children during the E-SPLOST even standing in the pouring rain to hand out flyers at the FCHS v. WWHS game that year.

Get the FACTS.

You may contact Charlie yourself at CharlieCave4boe@gmail.com.

Also, he is distributing information through Facebook. Please friend Charlie Cave and you can find out more about him.

If I hear of any meet and greets (NO YOU WANT NEILY BABY...CHARLIE DOESN'T DO SPEAKING ENGAGEMENTS!)or other events where you can meet Charlie, I will be sure to pass along. He is using a very small town approach of personal meetings which is less visible to most people.

Also you can check out the AJC voter guide at http://tinyurl.com/2fnso3t

Making an informed decision about the future of our schools is important, please pass this along to anyone you deem appropriate. Charlie may not be running the campaign that The Citizen wants him to run, but we should know our options before voting on TUESDAY JULY 20.

Neil

YOU MISRABLE LYING CREEP! WE GOT MORE..YOU WANT MORE? I CAN DO THIS ALL NIGHT...AND I CAN'T WAIT...JUST ASK ME FOR MORE...NAME A SUBDIVISION...

NeilSullivan
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Sugger you protest too much

Which part do you not like. Get to know the other candidate?

He helped me on the E-SPLOST?

Email him with questions?

Check out the AJC voter guide?

See his updates on Facebook?

Know your options?

It is sad, that you are so negative. I am tired of a select group thinking they are the only ones who have the answers.

Note it does not say vote for him.

Suzie
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Ethics

Neil,
Your use of the PTO mailing lists may, in fact, not only be unethical, but also illegal. That list was not intended for political use. Look into it before you send another one. Note Veritas' post about the email he/she received. It is inappropriate and you knew exactly what I was getting at by mentioning Smola and Warner,who were caught colluding in sending false emails under the guise of being a "concerned parent." You have a closer connection to Smola than her simply being your rep. The fact that you continue to refuse to acknowledge your friendship with her only makes your responses seem even more insincere. You have been shilling for empty-suit Cave, at Smola's request, on those lists and you are not fooling anyone.

NeilSullivan
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Hi Suzi - no need to worry

Didn't use the PTO list or the ESPLOST list. Was sent to 61 discreet people who are in my address book which means I have corresponded with them before and I thought they were interested in data. I was ssked to push the information out and choose not to send along a far greater span but Suggarfoot's posting will surely help. I have resisted posting Cave info as I feel it was his duty to do so, but Suggar did that for us. Feel free to get the facts from Charlie.

Remember my goal is to get the discussion out there, but since Cave will not repsond to Ben, did not feel it was appropriate to post in The Citizen but did want to help a very good man.

Friend is a word I use carefuly and would not apply to Janet as we have never broken bread together nor raised a pint which is a must for me. I will talk to and work with anybody who is committed to EXCELLENT FAYETTE COUNTY SCHOOLS. I have even shared ideas with people who I have opposed on these very pages.

Beleive what you want I do not care.

suggarfoot
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where does she find these Unics?

I don't get it.

TinCan
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I don't get it either

You trying to talk about a computer operating system or those guys that are no longer guys?

suggarfoot
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hint

It is ...NOT.. a computer operating system!

abc1234
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Re: hint

Then it is... NOT... spelled "Unics!"

Funny that you would call Cave uneducated... I bet he can spell "pathetic" and "eunuchs," or at least use spell check.

Also, turn off your CAPS LOCK and go easy on the punctuation. Just looking at those off-your-meds rants makes me dizzy-- you're discrediting every argument you make with that kind of poor composition, not to mention the over-the-top personal abuse. Seriously, "creeps?" Are you Glenn Beck? You'd think Charlie Cave, Neil Sullivan, Doug Warner, et al. were serial killers instead of citizens who care enough about their community to participate in a local election. Grow up and behave respectfully like an adult if you want people to take you seriously.

Courthouserules
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Philosophy of Schooling

There are two sorts:
We level everyone to the same attainment---as we do now. Even pass those who fail.

Or, we sort out those who can't or won't pass exams and make sure they learn how to make a good living with technical or trade schools.

I think this Todd fellow means the second one! Sounds good to me.
We used to just kick them out at 16 in the fifth grade!

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